1.0.17 Patch Notes

Official Announcements
#1

General:

  • New female armor and new crossbow execution added.
  • At least 1 Paladin will always spawn in Cult games.
  • REVERTED! Abilities that do not count as visiting will now bypass things that say they prevented you from “visiting”. (The wording was originally meant as prevented from targeting and was worded before non-visiting abilities. This should provide a minor buff to Psycho King and a few other abilities.)

Butler & Servant:

  • Concentrated Wine now bypasses occupy immunity. (This is the party ability)

King:

  • Starting King now has a 60% chance to be Good, 20% to be Neutral, and 20% to be Evil.
  • Order Execution will now announce to the court that the King ordered the execution of a player.
  • Order Execution will now bypass everything and will be unhealable.

Bug Fixes:

  • Fixed bug with Defile.
  • Fixed a bug allowing people to update their public journal right after they died.
  • Fixed a bug where a converted Unseen was promoted to Assassin after Assassin was promoted to Mastermind.
  • Added logs to help find a Possess bug, which may have been fixed. If you encounter this bug please post your output_logs in the bugs channel in our discord server.
5 Likes
The problem with WKM is that most games feel the same [My opinion]
#2

What was the thought process in changing the % chances of each King rolling? I understand that King was left out and not being trusted by BD at all, but altering the chances of each King seems an odd way to go about it.

It seems easier and simpler for new players to just give a BD king a large buff to make it worth it to take the risk of trusting him. I’m not talking aobut Allies, but something of equal power.

3 Likes
#3

Yes please

Merc should also give his target night immunity then so as to do his job properly

FINALLY!!! Party is useful now!

Good. The odds of him being bad is the main reason he isn’t trustworthy. Now he is.

Thats good. More things to scum read is better.

Everything? Even Jail? That sounds OP, I guess I will need to wait and see. I guess he can’t test phys claims now.

#4

I really like this

#5

hey they added my idea thats cool

unless they thought of it as well

still cool

#6

Gonna take a closer look at this real soon, but I’d go to 50/30/20 (or maybe 60/30/10) G/E/N Kings.

Otherwise, if you’re bumping up Paladin, why not also drop down Sheriff? :wink:

(I know why, but still)

#7

it doesnt matter if king is neut when we are talking about trusting the king, and its doesn’t matter if its 30% evil king or 33%…

#8

I just think that 20% evil is too low, and 20% neutral is too high considering that evil is also 20%.

50/30/20 seems like a reasonable choice. Flip a coin.

#9

Why? Paladin and sheriff need reworks, not buffs. Stop buffing the soft and hard counters.

This makes sense for the wording, but not for the game. The abilities that have it usually send someone else to do it(noble sends the maid and king sends guards) so it makes sense that you could still be prevented. Just change the wording and keep it the way it was(except for sorc).

Each faction should have an equal chance to have a starting king. It shouldn’t be biased towards one faction. And if the king being untrustworthy is an issue, then that could be done through something else. Like replacing order execution with another ability:
Confine(Unlimited) - During the day, your target will not be able to speak to or hear anyone but you. You will communicate with them in a separate chat. They may not be voted up for treason or targeted by day abilities. They may not use day abilities. Everyone will be told who you confine.
Order execution doesn’t really fit with the king’s theme anyways. The king should be a social class, not a killer.

2 Likes
#10

Interested to see how the patch plays out. Thank you for the updates.

#11

False. An unlimited use cop is important to these games. At most they might need small tweeks involving secondary Ability’s then let them (weakly) affect other classes like Neuts but I cannot stress enough how important it is to have someone with their primary Ability. Another thing to point out is that a faction check that only finds Unseen/Cult cannot fully clear someone, especially when you consider that it isn’t fool proof which is why it can be unlimited. A faction check is also the only way to truly know that someone who was cleared is now converted when they were something like Noble or Drunk before (especially with Unseen)

Changing the kings Ability’s did not and never can (without giving them seperate Ability’s anyways) make the king more trustworthy. The only things that can are his moment to moment actions (something which his current kit lets him do especially now that order is public) and the prior probability of him being scum. Since giving him the very public kit was not enough to make him trustworthy the only other thing they could do is mess with the probability.

For the record the reason why people were whispering to the king when he had Ally’s was because there was a greater reward for if he turned out to be good. In other words the ability can affect the Risk VS Reward dynamic by raising or lowering the risk or reward. However the actual odds of the Risk playing off have nothing to do with the ability he has because he will still be impossible to distinguish between the other alignments baised on the existence of the ability along since he would have that Ability even if he was Evil and he would still use it too.

#12

I mean I think current Sheriff is fine, but even though one should be guaranteed, they shouldn’t be unique nor unconvertible to allow fake claiming.

I don’t know about non-visits bypassing Prince’s Jail however, even if it bypasses Merc/Sellsword/Enforcer protection, Fool’s Hide, and Sheriff’s Surv. I think Prince should still override all “non-visits” for whoever is in jail, if this will happen.

2 Likes
#13

These are very promising changes. So far I’ve seen less early suspicion of the King and a risk/reward to the King’s kill ability. I’d probably be in favor of the 50/30/20 idea or 50/25/25, but we’ll see how this plays out. 40% chance to not have a BD king is a large chance, but not so large that we should insta-kill starting king.

I’m pretty satisfied with where the game is at right now - the few games I’ve played on this patch have felt balanced and not overly centered around a single class or two.

One thing to consider: I’d expect the King changes in this patch to be an indirect Butler nerf. One of the Butler’s main qualities is poisoning and killing the King. With this patch, not only is there a much greater chance to not need this ability, but the King’s kill ability, when used to help Evil, will simply get the King lynched the next day, bypassing the need for the poison. Plus, if an Evil King is poisoned, he can simply kill two more BD before he croaks.

Not a big deal, just something to consider as we figure out what to do with the Butler.

#14

I agree, but it should be balanced. Sheriff and paladin are not. Something like the maid from FoL should be added instead, that’s a balanced faction checker.

That’s part of the reason why it needs changes though. Abilities shouldn’t be specific like that. And faction checks which only check one faction will usually give only 2 results, which is a bit boring for an investigative class.

Agreed, but faction checks need to be balanced. They shouldn’t only tell one faction, that’s a bit OP, especially since sheriff is now confirmable.

#15

While maid is a great class and should totally be added I would like to point something out. Maid is not a faction checker. She is a faction comparer. None of her Ability’s outputs someone’s faction.

You seem to have a misconception that every Ability’s needs to be able to deal with everything. As a sheriff your main job is to find Unseen in the most straight forward way possible. Everything elses more detailed (but less damming) results can be used to help guide you and narrow people down but you do need to exist. If the results are too spacific then it might be a good idea to give him some other things he can see under spacific circumstances for example he might also get a limited use true Faction check. As long as it doesn’t make him confirmable you can make him more interesting with secondary Ability’s (surveillance is therefore bad because it is confirmable)

Being able to tell a faction like the Unseen (without also being able to get info on BD) is not OP. Having that Ability and being confirmable however is definitely OP (and why Obs Peek needs to be only 2 uses).

In other words we agree that sheriff needs to be fake claimable but not that he needs a full rework.

Note: All of these arguments also apply to the Paladin.

#16

Is this not supposed to happen or was it not happening?

2 Likes
#17

I’m not saying that. What I mean is that investigative abilities should be able to affect all, or at least most, classes.

That’s one of the problems I have with sheriff, it only affects the unseen. Expert investigation is a bit boring since it only has two possible results, and surveillance is overpowered. Sheriff needs another ability(that’s not overpowered/confirmable) to make him more fun to play.

That’s another one of the problems I have with sheriff. It should just be changed so sheriff can appear in both unseen and cult games, and expert investigation would determine if your target is cult or unseen(but not which one). Scout should just determine when your target’s class changes.

Agreed. Being unconvertable + unique + guaranteed is also OP.

#18

Actually even EI affects every class. NS clears them of being Unseen and that is important for most neuts (especially fool)

Agree

While I am worried that this might make possessors really hard to play I guess they could just make possess not count as a class change because technically you are now scouting a new player who’s class didn’t change.

The part about making him appear in both games is one I have suggested before. However Bos confirmed to me that he won’t be doing that (for whatever reason).

#19

I would like to say this: I genuinely think it is the best for the balance of the game for the King to have regular attacks, if he’s going to have a killer ability (I would personally prefer more Support or Social abilities on the King)

The fact that the King has two unstoppable kills makes it so possible for a Kings Out Meta to begin, which is really where I don’t want the direction to go. Yes, while 80% of the time, the King is Good and Neutral, (thank goodness), that 20% of the time where it is an Evil King, the King holds so much power that it is in the best interest of BD to get him out.

I just played my first game as an Evil King in this patch. Everyone whispered to me on Day 2, and then I had a Fool on executed on Day 4, allowing me to kill the Prince Night 4 and then the Psychic Night 5, even when they were both being healed and guarded, which heavily swung the game into the favor of the Cult from that point on.

It feels too overpowered to have a power like this. Hunter, I can understand, (except for allowing wolves to get into jail, as I believe nothing should be able to get to the jailed target except for Link Minds), but the King should definitely not have an OP ability as that one.

1 Like
#20

Agreed on unstoppable kills.

1 Like