How to make non-starting King's somehow unique

Feedback/Suggestions
#1

I have noticed that the lack of OE to the non-starting Kings are a hard punch to the power of the class. Obviously it has great reasons behind, as a confirmed GK or EK at the late game with the power of OE at their side can pretty easily win the game. This balance is fair. What I would like to have, however, are unique abilities for those that have the Royal Blood passive.

First of all: I feel like Royal Blood is just for confirming. It usually just confirms you or completely outs you as non-Royal for not stepping up. Usually only Nobles and Princess are going to step as well, since Prince and Drunk are much more useful with their abilities than a King (niche situations always happen, tho). A way to encourage the step as something more than just the power of the finger would be to give a unique ability depending of your class (that is if you are Royal Blood, give something different to everyone is complicated).

Noble/Aristocrat:
These classes have a great theme; gathering info. Not the usual detective stuff like Sheriff, Observer or Paladin, they just stalk everyone in the court with spies and gossip. Something to fit this aspect of their theme as King could be something alongside these ideias (the suggestion is not all of these being put in class, is more like a hand of options to choose one):

  • Make two players unable to whisper next day. (Night Ability)
  • See the complete feedback of abilities used on a player. 2 uses. (Night Ability)
  • Spy a logbook. 2 uses. (Night Ability)
  • Decide Fate. 2 uses. (Day Ability)
  • Know who was jailed, poisoned/bled and trollboxed at the end of the day. (Day Ability)
  • Gives your target the “Annouce” Day Ability, working exactly like Telepathy. (Day Ability)

I know some of them are hella strong, I’m just poiting out in-theme ideas that can be completely reworked. The idea here is more the “Unique” aspect of each king, not their abilities itself

Princess/Duchess:
These classes also have a great theme regarding their investigative abilities, using their charm or fire to help their factions. FIRST OF ALL CHANGE THEM TO “THE QUEEN”. Something alongside their theme, as King, could be:

  • Determine the player’s class. 2 uses. (Night Ability)
  • Invite a player to visit you, redirecting their target. (Night Ability)
  • Make the court unable to vote you next day. 1 use. (Night Ability)
  • If you are attacked this night, everyone will know who visited you. (Night Ability REMEMBER OLD PRINCESS?)
  • Put someone on trial immediatly. 1 use. (Day Ability)
  • Redirect any Day Ability to your target. 2 uses. (Day Ability)

Drunk/Alcoholic:
Even though the new Drunk is not anymore that much into his theme of getting so drunk that would get in the way of the Assassin, he still have his redirection power and HH. Being probably the second Royal in the list of “I don’t wanna be King, just confirming myself”, something worthy and thematic for him as King could be:

  • Occupy everyone. 1 use. (Night Ability)
  • Know who your target visits and occupy their target. 2 uses. (Night Ability)
  • If someone targets you they will be redirectioned to who you targeted. (Night Ability)
  • Force your target to vote in you. (Day Ability)
  • Force your target to vote in themselves. (Day Ability)

Prince:
The most niche King of all. The jail is so much better than the King abilities that for BD give up this power, they must be in a really bad condition. I believe the Prince > King conversion must be the most powerful one, making fair the abdication of Prince’s abilities.

  • Order Execution. 1 use. (Night Ability) This one I really think fits better the role
  • Send your target to prison, preventing them from visiting and get visited. 2 uses. (Night Ability, can’t exe like regular prison)
  • Make your target conversion immune for the night. 3 uses. (Night Ability)
  • Make your target fear the prison and randomly vote someone of their faction. 1 use. (Day Ability)

Overall I am not good at balancing, specially when all of this is just theorical and I don’t have the power to program this and test myself how it would work out. Don’t take the abilities itself too seriously, as the major point here is how I think Royals could get more special when becoming King.

3 Likes
#2

I love this idea! I have some picks based on what I think makes the most sense thematically/mechanically and are the least confirmable:

Noble/Aristocrat/RB Apostle

Trusted Spymaster (Night, 3 uses): You will receive the complete feedback of abilities used on target player. Does not count as a visit.

Princess/Duchess/RB Seeker

Sharp Mind (Night, 3 uses): You will know the target player’s class.

Drunk/Alcoholic/RB Invoker

Royal Charisma (Night, 3 uses): Redirect all visits made to you to target player.

Prince

Unbreakable Loyalty (Night; 3 uses): You will visit a player and determine if they are a member of the Blue Dragon or not. If they are, you will protect them from conversion.

I had some ideas to make Neutral Kings also more different from each other, but that can be for another topic another time.

Great ideas tho!

#3

Prince has no reason not to jail.

#4

If they’ve lost all their executions and they had a special ability that made up for the lack of jailing, it could be a viable option. Right now yeah, you basically never want to step up.

#5

We already had this before, not a lot of people liked it.

That’s too OP

Princess is an investigative class it shouldn’t have offensive abilities

Princess is not a social class.

Again Princess is not a social class and this is OP

Princess is not an offensive class

Prince is already OP

giving him 4 kills is making him too OP

#6

Noble/Aristocrat:
These classes have a great theme; gathering info. Not the usual detective stuff like Sheriff, Observer or Paladin, they just stalk everyone in the court with spies and gossip. Something to fit this aspect of their theme as King could be something alongside these ideias (the suggestion is not all of these being put in class, is more like a hand of options to choose one):
Make two players unable to whisper next day. (Night Ability)
See the complete feedback of abilities used on a player. 2 uses. (Night Ability)
Spy a logbook. 2 uses. (Night Ability)
Decide Fate. 2 uses. (Day Ability)

Considering you’re King, people should be giving you their logs anyways. So spying their logbook seems redundant unless you want to see if they’re doing double logs (Phys/Hunter) for example for Neutral Killers or Assassins

Princess/Duchess:
These classes also have a great theme regarding their investigative abilities, using their charm or fire to help their factions. FIRST OF ALL CHANGE THEM TO “THE QUEEN”. Something alongside their theme, as King, could be:
Determine the player’s class. 2 uses. (Night Ability)
Invite a player to visit you, redirecting their target. (Night Ability)
Make the court unable to vote you next day. 1 use. (Night Ability)
If you are attacked this night, everyone will know who visited you. (Night Ability REMEMBER OLD PRINCESS?)
Put someone on trial immediatly. 1 use. (Day Ability)
Redirect any Day Ability to your target. 2 uses. (Day Ability)

Make the court unable to vote you next day. 1 use. (Night Ability)
I feel this is a little weak only because if you’re Duchess this will get you instantly poisoned by the Butler instead.
Edit: I was half asleep writing this. Rather, this ability is a giant red flag you’re putting on yourself by using it, I feel it would only cause an easy dethrone for the Princess or Duchess in question. Though, the other two ideas are perfectly fine. The day abilities seem a bit too strong, besides for day abilities, Decide Fate & Royal Finger need to be apparent. Alternatively if they decided to get rid of Decide Fate for one of these unique abilities is also another thing.

Drunk/Alcoholic:
Even though the new Drunk is not anymore that much into his theme of getting so drunk that would get in the way of the Assassin, he still have his redirection power and HH. Being probably the second Royal in the list of “I don’t wanna be King, just confirming myself”, something worthy and thematic for him as King could be:
Occupy everyone. 1 use. (Night Ability)
Know who your target visits and occupy their target. 2 uses. (Night Ability)
If someone targets you they will be redirectioned to who you targeted. (Night Ability)
Force your target to vote in you. (Day Ability)
Force your target to vote in themselves. (Day Ability)

Instead of occupying everyone I figured perhaps this one might work more, I mentioned this earlier too!
Escort (Night Ability): Send a guard to a player and have them be escorted elsewhere. Does not bypass redirect immunity. You will be informed if it was successful or not.
This is good for both Drunk & Alcoholic turned King since you can redirect healers elsewhere, or redirect the Assassin/Cult Leader elsewhere if you think you have a lead. At least in my opinion.

Prince:
The most niche King of all. The jail is so much better than the King abilities that for BD give up this power, they must be in a really bad condition. I believe the Prince > King conversion must be the most powerful one, making fair the abdication of Prince’s abilities.
Order Execution. 1 use. (Night Ability) This one I really think fits better the role
Send your target to prison, preventing them from visiting and get visited. 2 uses. (Night Ability, can’t exe like regular prison)
Make your target conversion immune for the night. 3 uses. (Night Ability)
Make your target fear the prison and randomly vote someone of their faction. 1 use. (Day Ability)

I honestly like everything here about Prince, if you accidentally lose your executes or something unfortunate happens and there’s no other Royal Blood then I feel Prince can step here. He gains an Order Execute & still has the ability to jail.

All in all I like these ideas and I just felt I’d add my own input to give you a bit of direction since you did mention you were bad at balancing.

1 Like
#7

I feel like the kings should just get slightly beefier versions of their primary ability’s without breaking them or making them easily confirmable. Also they should all be Night Ability’s. King doesn’t have room for another day ability

Noble:

Night Spy - Get target players full feedback. Does not count as a visit(2 uses)

Princess:

Interagate - Get target player’s faction and class type. Does not count as a visit. (2 uses)

Drunk:

Mislead - Redirect your first target to you second. They will not be informed. Does not count as a visit. (2 uses)

Prince:

Ultimate Execution - Kill target player. Bypasses everything. Does not count as a visit. (2 uses)

3 Likes
#8

Yo, thanks for the answers everyone, but I just want to reinforce that the suggestion is the idea itself (Royal becoming King with unique effects) instead of the abilites that I just created while writing this to give some context to what I had in mind. I would even say I don’t want any of those being implemented, because I had little to no thought of how they influence the game and only did it for their classes themes/gameplay. I appreciate all the feedback, tho! Even got answered by a dev on Discord, so I’m happy this is getting discussed — just want to mare sure you’re discussing the right point :smile:

EDIT: Oh, but your suggestions are all great; not saying to not suggest abilities, it’s actually a good thing you do, just that mine are not to be taken seriously.

2 Likes
#9

Wait a Dev responded? Which one and what did they say?

#10

Thunder! He said that it’s a fun idea, but a little squeeze to EK as the BD is more likely to hand these abilities than EK, who has to be converted and step. I said it is “risk vs reward”, as the converted EK, even with the same abilities as GK, would still be more powerful since he knows who is Unseen by the time he became King. Nothing else besides Mirage giving some nice suggestions as well IIRC

#11

TBH I think regular Kings are fine they way they are. That’s just me though.

1 Like