New King changes makes winning as NK even harder

Feedback/Suggestions
#1

I was originally super interested in the idea of the King’s executes. When they went through night immunity, and were announced, I liked it even better. However as I’ve played a bit more, I’ve come to realize this makes it almost impossible for Neutral Killers to win.

Let me explain: before, getting checked as a neut was an auto loss, more or less, and that obviously wasn’t good. But with the new execute by the king, it basically forces Neutral Killers to target the King. For Sorc and Possessor, this is basically impossible. King can chain 6 guards in a row and be completely immune to anything these two do. By this time, there are usually quite a few deaths, which means claim space is completely limited, there are less players to guess, and king can more easily pick the NK out and kill them. Also this overrides possessor jump and kills him.

Reaper currently has the best case scenario, where he can empower reap the king but this forces the same play style for Reaper games in which you have to empower reap the king. If you get a little unlucky with reaps and are low on souls, this basically makes it impossible to win. Oh and if King deduces you before you empower reap him, his execute goes through your souls and instantly kills you.

I’m not really sure on a proper suggestion for this, as I do really like the idea of force execute going through immunities, but I feel it shouldn’t stop possessor jump and it shouldn’t go through reaper souls. Not sure on what I want for Sorc, but she has more problems than just this. I just think this creates an unhealthy meta where the optimal play as NK is literally to do nothing so more people are alive when King is out of guards. Basically extending game times just so you have a chance to win.

4 Likes
#2

We have the exact same opinion on Order Exe … Removing Allies was 2 steps forward for NKs but Order Exe is a step back.

With Allies, you had to empower reap King before he could check you. With Order Exe, you have to empower reap King before he deduces you (before Order Exe, you could still win as outted Reaper in late game by preventing players from voting).

#3

Well you can survive it now as Reaper. Sorc wins with an EK and can get him killed with CoD if she knows who he is killing/guarding and Possessor is the best at deceiving the king thus making him attack the wrong person while you jump away

#4

Plus. As sorc if you are outed you are either killing the king durring the day, working with an evil king or are dead anyway and as possessor you are dead anyways.

Plus it is still the same deal with the prince except you don’t know who prince is.

#5

It is a problem, but it is much better than allies. Reaper surviving doesn’t help much, since they well be executed the next day. Being a one man team is essential to the NK, and while it is hard, it’s kind of fundamental to the idea. Another ability might be better for King, but Order Execution is much better than Allies.

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#6

Can you survive as reaper? I thought it still went through immunities. I’ll take it word on it as I have yet to play the new patch.

Sorc is the worst nk anyway, so this is a problem tacked onto the mountain she has.

Possessor does have the deceit factor, but I feel he gets the worst of it being killed the night he could attempt to jump if people are suspicious. Maybe it’s not nearly as bad as I am making it out, but it’s there.

#7

I have not actually been Order Exe’d as Reaper, I’m just saying that based on the assumption Reaper would be killed. If Reaper can survive order exe it’s not that bad, since Reaper still has a chance to prevent players from voting him if he survives.

I’m not sure how I feel about order exe preventing Poss from jumping. I know Poss is amazing right now, they just fixed it where you can leave a deathnote when you jump! =D I think Poss and Reaper are fine, maybe let Reaper read victim’s logs immediately when they are reaped, but otherwise they are fine. It’s just order exe and sorc I don’t like.

#8

Even this isn’t a problem with EK being a thing.

#9

I think sorcerer would be fine if inquisitor were removed. But if inquisitor stays it definitely needs to lose the ability to kill all Cult. I mean if someone claims a non-magic class Inq can just yolo them which kills them if they’re evil or confirms them if they’re good.

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#10

If there is no Inquisitor, then Sorcerer needs to kill cult/unseen. That takes away the dynamic, even if I consider it a poor one, and takes away and Sorcerer uniqueness and replaces it with ToS Serial Killer.

#11

I’m happy with that

The sorc/inq/evil dynamic is awful. until they come up with a better one it should be removed and sorcerer should be just a regular neutral killer