Reworks concerning the 1.0.18 Meta

Class/Lore/Fanfic
#1

As people are saying, King is strong in this meta, which is a whisper King D2 Meta, Which I don’t find as a problem. But it needs a counter.

Also concerning another hot thread going around concerning the lack of framing and retribution, we need more of that. So my idea is this.

Analysis:

  1. Noble is mostly played as a weak whisper class.
  2. The King Whisper Meta is very strong.
  3. Noble and Aristocrat gets to see the King’s whispers on a limited amount.
  4. In replacing Snoop with Royal Advisor, they have lost out on a powerful but not a fitting ability.
  5. Their voting aspect must, therefore, be strengthened.
  6. Result: They must be buffed.

Analysis:

  1. Apostle is also buffed like Noble but gets fewer uses for each ability, fitting the theme of the Cult.
  2. It also gets a form of Telepathy to be like the Psychic.
  3. Because Noble gets buffed, Apostle gets buffed too.

Analysis:

  1. The Illusionist carries a very useful framing ability, Mind Warp, that should probably be more prominent among Evil classes.
  2. Mental Blur however, confirms an Illusionist, and does not really help at all.
  3. Mental Blur has been changed to be buffed up, but still allows people to talk after the first trial, so they can defend themselves if accused.

Analysis:

  1. Expose is usually completely unnecessary, but because some class needs to have that niche ability, Marshal will be fine with it.
  2. The Snoop that was taken from The Noble/Aristocrat/Apostle shows here in the form of Forge, which is a Day Ability so that Marshal can use the nighttime to edit the player’s logs and then plan on the Unseen killing said player.
  3. Unseen classes usually don’t last very long anyways due to the fast nature of the faction.
  4. Result: Snoop had to go somewhere.

Analysis:

  1. Unseen needs more framers to make framing a somewhat more prevalent thing in ToL.
  2. Duchess’ Dark Wisp becomes a framing tool.
  3. The NS ability is moved to a Day Ability to allow it to be used in non-conjunction to Bat Eyelashes.

Analysis:

  1. Assassin’s Distract is so weak
  2. Preventing Day Abilities will become much more useful and flexible in lots of ways.

Analysis:

  1. Expose is a niche ability, it would be fine to leave it on just the Marshal.
  2. And to match Unseen Investigative classes, the Seeker can also frame.

To also have a Day Offensive Ability, Invoker gets a buffed up Bewilder that is much more flexible and usable.

Analysis:

  1. Acolyte used to be a thing.
  2. Invoker got buffed up.
  3. So to make Invokers equally common as other converts and not twice as common,
  4. Acolytes are now Killer converts.
4 Likes
Whisper meta costs
#2

In general I think these are very good. The Aristocrat and Apostle changes are a terrific counter to the d2 whisper meta. Perhaps Royal Advisor could be one use only though - it’s strong.

Yeah, this is good.

I do like the idea of forging. The Marshal seems an apt choice. But having that + Blackmail is too strong. While you edit someone’s logs, you just point-and-click someone else to give a false result. Seems like double-dipping, ability-wise. Also, if Blackmail is included with a Fool and Scorned in game, that means we could have three false results in one night.

Agreed, but both Duchess and Marshal shouldn’t have a framing ability. I like that your proposed Duchess’ kit is actually centered around that strong ability - on the Marshal it feels like an addition rather than an identity.

This is more useful, yes.

This is fine, and makes Seeker more interesting to play.

1 Like
#3

well I’d say it helps a bit in day 1 meta… but roughly the moment it turns out to be an unseen game, people know there’s a 90%ish chance their whispers are safe. Unseens weakness is that they have at most 1 converted class in their team at a time, and as noble isn’t a certainty to begin with. It isn’t really worth it to adjust behavior to deal with a single potential class in the game.

#4

I like all of this

I feel like apostle should also have diplomacy and crimson call should be exclusive to psychic who got converted into apostle, other than that I like everything else

I feel like mental blur should kind of be like chill

I like the expose change, I also like forge but I don’t think it fits marshal

I like all of this

I like all of this

Interesting, I will have to think about this

#5

Would this affect prince’s ability to jail? Can you target the king?

#6

Would still target the King, and my hope is that doesn’t include Day Abilities like Imprison or Scout that take place at night, because if Prince can’t Jail, that’s broken