Should the All/Any rolelist remain?

Feedback/Suggestions
#1

I am curious if and when a role list game mode will be added to the game.

The role list unequivocally assists the Town (Blue Dragon) as it lets them narrow down claims that may be impossible giving them a natural edge. Evils must work much harder to develop a stable claim and avoid suspicion.

Of course, the natural progression of the role list funnels down to the scenario of “hang one, execute the other”. Even with a fully believable claim, Blue Dragon may still have the resources to eliminate an Evil role that did a great job of deceiving others. A 3 player kingmaking dilemma still allows a 50/50 chance of a Blue Dragon win if one is confirmed and the remaining two players are virtually identical levels of trustworthiness.

I personally really enjoy the All/Any gamemode. Maybe because it requires me to think more, or maybe it’s because I like seeing Evil roles actually win instead of getting steamrolled like they do in Town of Salem.

I would be surprised if devs never introduced the role list, but I wonder if ranked games will be a thing, and if they are would they be based on an All/Any set-up or with a standardized list?

I would love to see two ranked modes: All/Any and Rolelist.

All/Any could lead to ridiculous blowouts between teams. You’ll have games where only one Blue Dragon spawns and everyone else is neutral and evil. But the allure of infinite claim space for evils in a ranked mode sounds so much more fair and fun for evils that I am personally willing to laugh off ridiculous games where it is so stacked against me.

The rule of Law of Large Numbers also promises that if you play enough games, the odds of you getting an average amount of games that ARE fair increases.

My question is- what would a fair role list look like?

#2

it’s not all any

Always a King
Always a Prince
Always a Sheriff/Paladin
Always a Mastermind/Cult Leader
Always an Assassin/Seeker(although the confirmed Seeker may change)

I think there’s about 2 dedicated neutral slots, and a couple that could go BD or Neutral

Bos has said before people aren’t going to be given the precise workings on how everything rolls, but it is by no means all any

#3

Indeed, the mystery of the rolelist can make that second fool get the win sometimes

#4

It isn’t all any. I am so happy they have decided to keep the the role list hidden to players, it makes it actually based on tactics and scumreading not shitty VFR like ToS.

Although they should totally add an All Any mode with CL and MM for maximum disgusting broken yet fun gameplay.

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#5

I’d love a 20 player cult vs unseen vs bd mode

#6

As long as there is NEVER a “ranked” mode, we’re good.

#7

Would be nice if like you could have something to track your wins VS loses in your forum profile or something though

Or if ranked mode was actually worthwhile (The only good thing about ranked on TOS was you were less likely to encounter trolls, cheats or Gamethrowers)

#8

Ranked in a conversion game is a BAD IDEA.

#9

  1. There will not be a role class list. This is boring and bloats the UI~

  2. There will be different game modes/types. Probably sooner than you think.

  3. There will be ranked.

Ranked in a conversion game is a BAD IDEA.

This is personal opinion :stuck_out_tongue: We say it’s a great idea, as long as it curves based on ELO

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#10

What

How

It’s literally impossible to make a sound elo system in a game where your side can be stolen part way through a match

Like you can be the best BD player in the whole game, get converted in a last-ditch effort, and then lose the game you single-handedly won

It’s a bad idea and it’s not worth attempting, in any capacity. Conversion mechanics are essentially anti-skill-based features, and trying to rank players based on skill in such a mode will not work out well. Maybe if Ranked has conversion disabled it would work, but at that point you’re making some major changes for the sake of a mode that isn’t all that special to begin with.

#11

What if they include the conversion factor into the math and gain of point is not based on winning, but rather other things I don’t know of?

Really, it can be fun.

#12

How do you measure a game like this based on anything but wins?

#13

I don’t know.

#14

That’s something they need to figure out

#15

I’d rather they focus on improving the game itself tbh

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#16

That too. I think if mm gets replaced when it dies early, it should lose sheriff detection immunity

#17

I hadn’t thought about how conversion could really mess up “true” wins and losses.

An excellent player could be completely killing it as BD only to set themselves up for demise later when they get converted last minute…

Would optimal play involve a plan that involves your own potential conversion? That feels like it might encourage gamethrowing scenarios where you do not help your own team to the best of your ability.

Tricky. Yeah, I have no clue.

#18

You pretty much hit the nail on the head. It’s a near impossible issue to solve, if not completely so - otherwise conversion wouldn’t be a near-universally hated mechanic amongst skilled Mafia players.

#19

Welcome to ANY ranked game that’s not 1v1! Do awesome the entire game, then 1 person on your team goes AFK the last round. Do epic the entire game, then your partner just charges in Leeroy Jenkins style. It’s not that different: Technically, any game with ranked that isn’t 1v1 is broken to begin with.

But yea, we’ll think of something. Math ftw!

#20

No, bevause in those cases acting to further your faction doesn’t harm your end goal.

In a conversion-based game, playing well may directly harm your chances of winning later on. It’s as if all of the rules of the game are changed on the fly.

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