[VFM] A Hat in Time Cop13er - Town Wins!

Yeah… hm.

Alice’s treatment of Pigeon is really rubbing me the wrong way. I mostly agree with Chloe that the way he defended himself from Alice felt like a villager’s defense because of how aggro it was. Alice’s push on him reads as very smothering, and the specific unfairness in the post Chloe brought up here is the greatest concern. Pigeon shouldn’t be expected to 100% find a wolf on day 1.

That said, I know her pushes as V can be very aggressive like that regardless of the target’s alignment. I think she’d commit less to the push if she were a wolf pushing on a villager. Or Pigeon’s just a wolf and I’m being stupid thinking his reaction was villagery for him.

I know I was supposed to stop discussing Alice, but.

I actually think the likeliest wolf on the playerlist from who I’ve read so far is LiLi, who I’m already voting. I pretty much agree with Cream that she’s really defensive and the defensiveness is really out of place. She’s struggling to integrate herself into the game, it seems, and the very moment Cream mentions this, she continues to come across as very defensive. Almost scared, even. It’s like Chloe’s anxiety when she’s wolfing, except not really hidden.

Speaking of which, I’m leaning town on Chloe, because I like her takes. That said, her opener notably didn’t suck (others brought it up before and I agree), and most of the time I played with her lately (except for the last game), I scumread her for her opener and she was V. This… probably shouldn’t mean much, though.

…Absolutely not. It can be W/W.

I don’t think it is, because I’m leaning village on both rn (Chloe’s defense of him felt villagery and not TMI-laden, while his posts on Alice felt more aggro than anything his scumgame had ever been able to muster), but the posts you quoted don’t make it impossible at all. Why did you think it was the case?

Said by someone who had recently preflipped Alice as W/W with Centuries because she softly defended him at some point.

Something something hypocrisy is a town trait?

the last time i called out hypocrisy it was from you and you were a wolf though :thinking:

Alignment-indicative or not? :sweat_smile: :joy: I mean, unless you think Cream’s posts could be workshopped or something lol

Are you offering to be the Lissi Tunnel Experience™ litmus tester this time? :joy:

You mean it’s not possible that the frustration was coming from wolf trying to use a RT as a justification to push a Pigeon wagon, which Vul ruined? (The frustration was NAI to me, since it’s a response any person would make if their plans were messed up)

Same thought on the deadlines. I’d like @Cream to expand on why it has to be D1.

You disliked that? I like it myself since it can be used by the target a town (as in it would help them survive to D3 and buy more time to make reads).

Why do you think Cream can’t correctly townread you? She said “if I can’t find you town D1”.

Not just that, it’s also too confident, considering the posts themselves aren’t so strong as to remove the W/W association.

I’d also give her time. I think there’s a method I can use to read her, but I’ll have to see if she does certain things. I’ll bring this method up later in the day.

Villagery.

Villagery, and I agree.

…AgreeD? Still think the take alone is villagery for Cream.

Also, I’mma pull an Appel.

Alice/Marl not W/W :joy_cat: Except I think there’s a lot of evidence for it in their case.

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That’s why I framed it as a question.

I unironically think this makes Alice town, but I’m not going to elaborate on the why. I think she might be able to figure it out.

I’ll explain if I have to.

I would definitely rather you explain

Half the thread is a discussion about the strength of people’s wolfgames.

Come on, people.

Congrats now 40% of the thread is a discussion of people’s wolfgame strength and 10% of the thread is complaining about it

Society thrives

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i have no idea why i’m responding so savagely

Alice isn’t playing like someone who expects to be peeked red. Her posts surrounding her wolfgame are all pretty much begging for a cop check on her tonight. So, unless she already knows who the cop is and will kill them tonight, she should be a villager here.

This doesn’t make her the cop, nor am I outing her as the cop. I’m just saying she probably wouldn’t go on and on about this as a wolf, because the cop exists.

I already pretty much broke the vow I made in that post, so.

I think this is town, by the way.

I wrote my opener the same way Chloe wrote her wolf openers in the past, word for word, except the cat and ceiling remark. I don’t normally swear, but the reference is slightly cryptic, I guess? I don’t think even Chloe got it.

I do? I didn’t even realize.

This post is a lot of words without a conclusion of any kind, by the way.

Because I’m not great at wolf theater reads to begin with.

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Mathematically, in most setups, wolves comprise 25% of the players, and the other 75% are town. Hence =rand W is 25% wolf and =rand V is 75% town.

rand W and >rand V refers to perceived odds above those levels.

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This feels wolfy.

And this is just wrong. Cream’s shared a lot of insights already. Zone claiming she hasn’t reads to me like he doesn’t care about solving her - or doesn’t want to. Doubly suspicious considering they seem to have pregame experience and should want to solve each other. Zone framing her posts as not AI isn’t in good faith. He seems to want to keep her out of towncore by doing this (subtly).

You didn’t solve anything. I’m disappointed. I read 400 posts only to find an unsolved game.

Marl bad.

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@Psyx You’ve asked like 40 questions and drew like 0 independent conclusions / made 0 independent reads. Mind giving us any if you have them?

Is Ruri literally 0-posting AI at all? Some people like Marl and Alice have been saying Ruri’s an ez read.