[VFM] A Hat in Time Cop13er - Town Wins!

[LiLi041]

wow this thread is quiet lmao

@Centuries

people turning a blind eye to appel spew is kinda wolfy tbh

who’s turning a blind eye to appel spew lol

[Marluxion]

@Centuries

has Emilia been in thread like at any point since she got votes

literally was going to ask this same thing

[Alice]

This is basically textbook W!Emilia defeatism, tbfh.

[Alice]

This is FoL.

We don’t do spew analysis. We just tunnel on microreads.

[Psyx]

Hey guys, I’m here! Sorry I wasn’t around that much this week; things were hectic at work (sorry if I lost my temper a few times too, especially to @Silviu200530 @Centuries)

I’ll skim the thread and look at the ISOs now, but if anyone wants to talk just lemme know

[Alice]

Cheese is probably wolfing.

Discuss.

[Psyx]

On Vulgard:

Appel mostly ignored him. Based on how she was just doing surface-level reads, her questions lacked force/direction, and she had a cautious/defensive behavior (like when Lili was grilling her), I don’t think Appel is the type to hardbus a scumbuddy (which is why I believe Alice is town, due to how Appel had been hyper-focused on her on both D1 & D2) and is more likely to ignore or defend them.

According to his meta, town Vulgard makes lots of wallposts and share his thoughts, while wolf Vulgard is awkward:

@Appelsiini

Vul is a wild card because he’s changed his meta recently, but I’ve yet to see it for myself. He used to be an obvious town - and by extension, an obvious wolf - whenever he played.
T!Vul makes a lot of wallposts and has complex-yet-easy-to-understand thoughts
W!Vul is just… there, probably making awkward jokes or something

@Appelsiini

When has Vul EVER posted like this
It feels soo so so awkward

This would otherwise be whatever, but Vul has a habit of narrating his own experiences and meta when he’s town afaik. So this is just weh

@Appelsiini

I read some of Vul and Cent’s posts and what stood out the most was that my opinion on Vul’s posting was the complete opposite of Cent. Quite literally. He called out a few posts as towny/wolfy and I couldn’t wrap my head around it, weh.

Is Vul still a polarized player
The only game I’ve played with him somewhat recently was Dragonvale, and while he kept saying I shouldn’t treat him as obvtown, he was a villager anyway so shrug

@Appelsiini

Vul had some incredibly awkward comedy attempts in the beginning, but other than that, his solving is good. The back-and-forth between Cent and Vul was awkward from both sides, but they were the only people posting so I’m willing to give that a pass

This is like
Obvtown levels of posting

I don’t think Vul would form a V read on Centuries that’s Centered around himself right after being scumread by the only people that were existing at the time, and push that narrative. In other words… it shows a towny lack of self-awareness?

D1 readlist:

Vulg, ZoneWazzaCheese, and Marl were neither in her POE nor “most likely miscleared” list.

@Appelsiini

I already gave my reasoning when I voted her, and responded to the same question afterwards. I don’t have a lot of posts, so it shouldn’t be too hard to find them^^

My current PoE is Chloe/Pigeon/Cream/Psyx/Ruri/Silviu which… is kind of bad, to be honest? Because I have no read on half of them, and it’s more of a matter of townreading everyone else. I don’t think all the wolves are in there. If I’m misclearing someone, it’s most likely in LiLi/Alice/Cent

Either way, now’s not the time for that. Right now I just want to sort out my inner PoE before moving on

D2 readlist:

@Appelsiini

Centuries
LiLi/Mistyx
Vulgard/Wazza/Marl
Ruri
Alice/Psyx
Silviu

I mindmelded on the Centuries thing with LiLi right as I posted my wallpost, so that’s a very good look for them. Vul/you/Marl/Ruri are all weak reads because it’s been a while since I’ve focused on you, but I don’t remember anything noteworthy from Ruri, other than Alice saying that they’re strictly in their town meta. I’m willing to believe that, to be honest. Wouldn’t lunch them today.

-end-

She didn’t really have an opinion on him and focused mostly on Alice/Chloe/Lili/ZoneWazzaCheese/Marl on D1, and on Alice/Silviu/me/Lili on D2. There was also that Zone & Lili discussion, where Vulgard was the first one to sus Zone for voting Alice (for not pressuring Lili). Vulg was mostly backseating while Appel questioned both Zone and Lili, but then she dropped it and switched to Marl instead (for defending Zone). And after that, she shaded Alice for not pressuring Lili.

Considering Appel even had some barebones interactions with Ruri, I think she and Vulg were mostly distancing from each other, so he’s a very likely scumbuddy for her.

[Psyx]

Gonna take a break, then I’ll continue with Appel/Ruri.

[Marluxion]

@Psyx

According to his meta, town Vulgard makes lots of wallposts and share his thoughts, while wolf Vulgard is awkward:

No, this is wrong
Wolf Vulgard range is actually huge
His last wolf game he pocketed the entire thread before being outed by a red with a jailkeeper

[Marluxion]

He even manipulated me into fake claiming a role to defend him and he didn’t even ask!

[Alice]

Emilia hasn’t posted in like 36 hours.

I feel like Vulgard’s alignment is a foregone conclusion, tbfh.

[Marluxion]

@Emilia if you are town you must post
Please

[Marluxion]

If you’re a wolf resigning to your fate I respect it

[Alice]

@Alice

Three things I’ve gotten from Appel’s spew/interactions.

1. From how Appel repeatedly shaded Cent’s wagon non-stop while insisting he was a villager despite getting a lot of heat basically reads a lot like TMI on Cent being a villager and her trying to chain a ML on Psyx/Silviu.

2. Appel being frustrated at Mistyx getting SHC’d and trying to downplay it doesn’t really look W/W as she’d probably be trying to help a wolf partner be miscleared rather than throw a hissy fit over it.

3. I think Wazza’s just a wolf as her approach to Appel was just textbook plinko board from how she suddenly had a confident SR on Appel because “she read her ISO” to completely ignoring her, and when she became the only viable CW to the cop she immediately started shading everyone outside the wagon while claiming to be put “out of the PoE”

Aside from it I think Emilia’s the last wolf as she has nothing to go for her and the fact that I didn’t die n1 probably means my n0 was wrong.

I’m at…

V

---

Alice
Silviu
LiLi
Marl
Centuries
Phraze
Psyx
Mistyx

Emilia
Wazza

---

W

Basically, b2b Emilia/Cheese and that should be game.

I had a 5-man PoE of Wazza/Appel/Vulgard/Cent/Silviu at SoD2 but I couldn’t talk about it because of lolcover. Silviu being the cop and Appel spewing Cent basically gave me the exact solve.

[Psyx]

On Ruri:

Appel barely had any opinions/reads on Ruri at all and they only had 2 interactions, so this could be distancing behavior too. She only questioned Ruri’s “hedgy reads” a bit, then when Alice said that Ruri was in her town meta, gave her a townlean and called it a day. It’s really suspicious how even though a bunch of people (Alice/Vulgard/Silviu/Marl/Ruri) said they found Cent sus, Appel only went after me and Silviu and disregarded Ruri.

Appel shading Alice for going after the low posters

@Alice

…I feel Chloe/Centuries have a point and because of how villagery most current posters are that there’s a pretty decent chance of there being at least 1 wolf in Silviu/Phraze, tbfh.

@Appelsiini

Do you think this is like… Autumn Invitational, was it?

You’ve been enforcing this same PoE since the beginning of the day which is A Thing in itself, but realistically speaking, the chances of all wolves being in the lower posters are really low

@Appelsiini

Well… all the posts that talk about your PoE and scumreads, to be honest?

Your reads feel like you pointed out things that are factually correct, but don’t represent how you feel about those players at all? Making Pigeon today’s lunch when he’s one of the people with the least thread presence just feels wrong to me, and I don’t agree that we should lunch all the low-posters for being low-posters when there are people that are worth focusing on more

@Appelsiini

The notion that we should kill the low-posters for not being on par with the top-posters

Half of the playerlist is known for being good players (and good wolves) and it’s part of the reason I joined in the first place

So assuming that the game will be easy just feels iffy to me

Interaction 1 - Questioning Ruri's read/POE

@Ruri

I skimmed through @Silviu200530 ISO and like the tone, but don’t quite remember the content.

@Appelsiini

How confident are you in this read?

@Appelsiini

I might ISO Ruri/Cream/Psyx/Silviu soon if I have the energy. It’s getting late, so I’d really rather just talk to people though

@Ruri

Not sure if this is a read. At least I’ve seen enough that I’d give them the benefit of doubt for now.

@Ruri

I’m not sure if ISOing me is gonna be fruitful, since you were here the whole time I posted.

@Appelsiini

Alright. Who would you lunch today, then? Give me 2 names, anyone goes!

@Ruri

Comfortable with, for now:
Alice
Silviu
Chloe
Cream
Appelsiini

Played with before, but no idea:
Vulgard
Marl
Centuries

Don’t know:
thepigeonnyc - Underwhelming ISO.
Zone_Q11 → Wazza
LiL
Psyx

@Appelsiini

Can you explain these? Please and thank you
(note: the ones highlighted in orange in previous quote)
Good night

(Note: I don’t think Ruri ever replied to this)

Interaction 2 - Questioning Ruri's reads and saying they are hedgy

@Ruri

Well, I think Alice is V here. Appel, I’m guessing is V too.
Chloe and Silviu are debatable slots for me.

And I’m watching out for Marl. In a recently finished game, W!Marl tried to pocket me. Could be trying the opposite now.

@Appelsiini

What makes them debatable? The nightkill is heavily indicates that Chloe is V from what I gathered, unless wolves aren’t interested in cophunting. There’s technically a chance that they just wanted to get a false clear on someone, but given how demotivated Chloe was during Day 1, I don’t think wolves would go to such lengths. Pigeon flipping V… I don’t know if that makes her look better or not, I still her actions Day 1 were mostly NAI, weh. It’s a matter of “was the brief comment from Pigeon enough to warrant a wallpost to hard-defend him” which I still don’t entirely agree with, but I’d also feel bad if I’m just pushing someone who correctly identified and defended LHF - for a while, at least.

@Ruri

Pushing me for no access to the site is a very poor reason, and maybe an attempt to look TWTBAW. In Marl’s wolf game, he tried to derp the setup.

@Appelsiini

@Marluxion this is one of those lame takes. Lying about non-game-related things would be weird, and I don’t think you really believe that they’d go radio silent for 24+ hours voluntarily, unless wolves have been in an excellent position right from the start (and thus wouldn’t need Ruri’s contribution to the game)

@Ruri

I looked through Psyx’s ISO, and am unsure about them.

Asked questions but didn’t attempt to make any reads out of the interactions. Most of the questions and answers were basic and doesn’t seem to push their thoughts either way. Busy work.

Not villagery to me, but it could be playstyle.

@Appelsiini

Are hedgy reads normal for V!Ruri
This is meh

@Alice

Yeah, she also does this “it could be playstyle” takes as V.

I hard-pushed her over it in that Thirteen Decades, tbfh.

@Appelsiini

Alright. Does she have any strong towntells/scumtells?

@Alice

Check out the wolf game I linked.

She has a very hard time giving out reads at all due to TMI and so basically spends much of her time as a W by throwing out questions without following or naked votes to look productive.

Her starting the game by making reads, even shallow ones, is very >rand V for her.

@Appelsiini

Mhm… I’ll do it later. I’ve played with her on MU a few times, but I don’t remember her meta too clearly.

Other - re: Centuries & mentioned while defending against Lili

@Appelsiini

Why are people voting Centuries, for example?
@Ruri @Silviu200530 @Psyx I’d like to get an answer to this. I already pointed out that the entire thread scumread him, which is a heavy indication that Cent is a villager. I hazily remember one scumcase someone made on him, and I guess everyone jumped on it, because no one’s discussing this slot. I’ve been skimming the posts to stay caught up, but I feel like no one’s really saying anything?

This thread atmosphere has felt extremely weird and stagnant during the entirety of D2, and I can’t be the only one who sees this. I’m the one who’s been away for most of the day, for god’s sake~!

@Appelsiini

If I want to do some worldbuilding, I’d start looking at my weaker townleans – Vul, Wazza, Marl and Ruri. But now’s not the time for that. I’d be alright with a Silviu flip, and Alice should definitely be checked sooner rather than later.

@Appelsiini

I’m not going to write cases while I’m busy, and definitely not before they respond to the questions I asked them. I did this with Ruri too; I pointed out things that I saw as scummy, but got a response that hedgy reads were very much in their townrange, and more likely to come from V!Ruri than W!Ruri. In short, this can basically be summed up as a playstyle difference; once again, you’re free to push me for it if you think it makes me a wolf, but this is ultimately a useless argument and we’ll just keep going in circles while coming back to this same point.

[Psyx]

I meant that’s what Appel said regarding Vulg’s meta.

[Psyx]

Gonna look into Vulgard/Ruri next

[Psyx]

This feels like Appel just mentioned/interacted with Ruri just to be able to say that they had some kind of interaction. Ruri and I were both townread for the same thing (IIOA wolfgames) but she only voted/found me ~wolfy~ for it.

[Marluxion]

I have decided I am ready to lose to wolf Psyx
If they are a wolf they are simply in another class
I am playing the entirety of the rest of this game without even a smidgeon of paranoia of them being scum

[Marluxion]

and if scum night kill them you are conceding that they are too good of a villager for you to handle which is a coward’s way out