[VFM] JoaT^2 - (6/15) - 😹 Pirates (Town) Win!

[Wazza]

I’m right here just lurking but I’ve only had 4 hours of sleep and I don’t want to say anything random.

[Wazza]

If you also want reasoning on why I didn’t do much yesterday, a bunch of us were in a group call through the night (My Timezone) and afterwards I was too tired and did some things for my life and then went bad, got forced to wake up though.

Anyway, I do think I should give my reads, well the important ones.

I still stick with Sulit being a spiteful Town.
Mole I haven’t seen much from so I can’t give a red.
Vulgard I will decently say he’s been acting suspicious this game and raising red flags.
Gorta’s inactivity isn’t really a scumtell. What is a scumtell however is finding out if he’s getting annoyed about certain reads on him.

[Flameo]

I don’t mean this offensively, but have you played for long? I know many players that love to meme they are scum. In another vein, many that love to gambit.

It might be specific to certain site meta’s as well I guess.

I wish more players would have the same mindset as us. It’d likely make it easier to read, but I realistically don’t think that’s the case. On the other hand it gives some diversity. Let’s not pursue this discussion too much, but resume it post game if you’d wish.

@Wisp

And for someone like Lo to hard push a thunderdome, and not be [redacted] will honestly blow my mind

Didn’t they even have quotation marks around it? I agree with your sentiment that that should be resolved overnight, which is an additional reason my vote stays on Vulgard.

[Wazza]

I read Io as Sulit for some reason,

I stick with Io being ranged from scummy to townie (I re-eval’d them and their content before all the things happened wasn’t too bad)

[Wisp]

The site I mainly focus on does not meme in that way in the slightest

[Flameo]

Please do prioritize your health over a game. Four hours is not that much.

I like your demeanor a lot more than yesterday and for that I commend you.

[CatLover]

Going to ISO moleland after I go grab a snack. If anyone has any questions for me (specifically about the Wazza case, but i’ll also accept any questions in general) for me when I get back, please let me know!

[Flameo]

I look forward to your case on Vulgard!

[Wazza]

I’ll be going sleep in 3 hours anyway to fix my sleep schedule once and for all so I’ll be up for a bit.

Anyway, I’m just being less of an ass is all. Also I do think I want to add Centuries to the pool of being lynched today, comparing how they’re playing today towards DGADT (Where they were a confirmed town mason), it just feels off? I don’t know how to explain that but that’s the vibe I’m getting.

[Flameo]

Hmm, what do you think about the point on Centuries I made like 5 posts ago? (my posts)

[Wazza]

I’ll be honest, you’re on the right track and I can visibly see what you’re saying, but I don’t think you’re stating it properly nor trying to get that point across.

While yes, your post categories Centuries into clearly not playing his townmeta, you need to push the point or the agenda, even if you townread it, sometimes you have to play Devil’s Advocate.

[SirDerpsAlot]

@Flameo

So lynch pool: Mole/Vulgard/Io/Gorta

No

[Wazza]

Then what is the lynchpool instead of just saying ‘no’

[Flameo]

@Wazza

I’ll be honest, you’re on the right track and I can visibly see what you’re saying, but I don’t think you’re stating it properly nor trying to get that point across.

While yes, your post categories Centuries into clearly not playing his townmeta, you need to push the point or the agenda, even if you townread it, sometimes you have to play Devil’s Advocate.

This confuses me… I’m not categorizing them as not playing their town meta. I have no idea what their town meta is. I think their progression on Ash, being followed up with remorse the next day felt real.

[Flameo]

Sir, please elaborate a bit more and make a case. Maybe I am wrong and you can be like “haha, I was right suckers” at the end of the game, but you will still have lost in addition then.

[sulit]

quotes i have gathered because im weird like that

@Vulgard

/vote Vulgard

@Vulgard

First game I played with little to no RVS, already enjoying this.

My vote is on a wolf, bus me and quickyeet me before town can do anything.

@Vulgard

I am unironically townreading Derps for OwOing. I think as scum he either doesn’t care or makes fun of me, but here he’s expressing curiosity in the weirdest way possible.

Could be a faked post, obviously, but I don’t think wolf!Derps fakes that specific thing. So, yeah.

@Vulgard

Something’s up with kat this game, I think. Their entrance felt… slow. Like they tried to settle into the thread as easily as possible (by voting sulit) instead of doing it naturally. Don’t know if it makes sense, but it’s worth a vote fmpov.

/vote katze

@Vulgard

Stop scumreading me for townreading you, that’s stupid. Vote actual wolves.

@Vulgard

CallMeIo projects strong LHF energies by posting in an intentionally “weak” way early on.

@CallMeIo

All of us in this thread could be Town!

The scum could be the zero posters!

I don’t think a wolf ever writes this. It’s impossible that Io means it as either alignment, but it’s not a type of post a wolf writes in the shitposting stage. It’s too easy to jump on.

@Vulgard

“You should be doing things right now” is a wolfy excuse for an early vote on someone. That type of vote is also almost exclusively aimed at a villager (if it comes from a wolf).

@Vulgard

I really should’ve used an alt for this game, this is getting way too annoying to deal with.

@Vulgard

I no longer think that after you wrote this, so any explanation is going to be moot.

@Vulgard

Because the mindset of town making an early vote isn’t “this person didn’t do awesome things with their early posts, so they must be a wolf.” It’s “this person did suspicious things early on, they must be a wolf.”

Jumping on a silly post that says something about scum being in the lowposters is a very low-level thought for a villager, and Flameo doesn’t come across as a very surface-level player.

@Vulgard

Literally the one I responded to, I think the way you’re handling my slot is very consistent with your villagery thought process in the last FoL.

@Vulgard

I have no opinion about Wisp whatsoever, but GTH town.

@Vulgard

From my experience, wolves almost never have the tone you do, even if it’s being faked.

Townleaning you for that reason alone.

@Vulgard

Possibly W/W too but I find both of them independently villagery. Sulit seems free-flowing and she’s far more level-headed as a wolf. Wisp’s borderline shitposting is a decent look because I think it shows a high level of comfort in the thread.

@Vulgard

@CallMeIo

It means that my Rolecard is Green!

Like, come on, guys. Look at these posts and tell me this isn’t LHF. I sense immense LHF energies.

Maybe I was wrong about calling their posts LHFy on purpose , but either way, yeah.

@Vulgard

@katze

sulit actually making a push on D1 is >rand V

bonus points because it felt real

:[

@Vulgard

@Vulgard

Their posts are just… so obviously underwhelming, I’ll be surprised if this flips wolf. From my experience, the obvious answer is rarely the answer.

I might change my mind if they continue to be underwhelming throughout the day.

@Vulgard

The amount of time ash has spent defending himself should be telling about his alignment, but I have no idea what conclusion to draw. I’ve only played with him once and I misread him when he was town. But in that game, he spent less time defending himself and more time actively scumhunting, even though I kept voting him and pushing for him.

So, based on my experience from that one game, his obsession with defending his slot is wolfy. But I’m not certain about it.

@Vulgard

I wanna build a towncore.

sulit

@Vulgard

It’s easy as hell to read me because my wolfgame hasn’t had enough time to be trained and refined in comparison to my towngame.

@Vulgard

Guess no villagers are around. This game is extremely NA-heavy, which is a fweh moment.

@Vulgard

To be fair, if we look at her last towngame as a baseline, she’s performing significantly worse this game. Analysis is a lot more shallow, far less investment in the game, too.

@Vulgard

Meh, I’m kicking her out of my towncore until she steps up.

@Vulgard

/vote Moleland If I’m not doing that already.

@Vulgard

I don’t think Derps cares about the game, which is town indicative for him.

@ash4fun Please write more about other people’s posts and less about your own, thanks. I liked the way you started but then you got sidetracked.

@Vulgard

@sulit

It’s also sucky you’re using the anon game to meta read me as I purposely tried to play different and tried out different methods to read people. I specifically played on an alt because I don’t want to be held to that standard of play in normal games.

I don’t want to do that either, which is why I’m not going like “SULIT =/= VENUS, LOCKSCUM.”

@Vulgard

I dislike the way Leafia behaves as a result of getting townreads. #NotMyTowncore.

She’s gone into the realm of calling people agenda-pushers and buzzwording people who doubt her villageriness. I think she’s capable of toning it down as town, or should be.

@Vulgard

@Leafia

Wow. Shots have been fired already. Also, I’m an IC that’s masons with App.

I should note that I strongly dislike her first post of the game.

Wolves very frequently open with a “wow” statement like this. This shows fake emotions related to the gamestate. “Wow, X happened.” “Wow, Y happened.” It’s pretending that you care… when you don’t.

The second part is a seemingly innocent meme, but gives me bad vibes.

@Vulgard

I wish you randed town more often so I could pick up on what the hell you do as town. I feel like you don’t have significant meta tells.

@Vulgard

Mole/Io/sulit/Flameo are people I want to kill. Maybe add Leafia to the pile.

@Vulgard

Kat seems to think I’m a wolf and I can’t wait for the case that buries me.

@Vulgard

I like both wagons. What do I do?

Ash’s readlist had a few issues, some of which are related to the townreads being lazy (which someone has already brought up before me). In general, I get the impression he’s struggling this game, and that’s ?usually? scum indicative.

Still prefer Mole because he literally did nothing.

@Vulgard

@sulit

/vote ash

wheeeeee

I hate how this vote distances ash wagon from the Mole wagon for no apparent reason.

@Vulgard

Paragraph 1: Mole shades a lot, hedges a lot, and has too many nullreads. Scummy.
Paragraph 2: But he has no agenda…
Paragraph 3: But he should still die.
Paragraph 4: You should vote him.

I feel like there’s something off about this progression. It’s like you saw signs of towniness (lack of agenda) and decided to ignore them (you want Mole dead anyway).

The only thing preventing me from swapping me vote is that the progression is rather blatant.

@Vulgard

The kill’s an interesting maneuver.
Didn’t do any reading overnight.

/vote sulit

@Vulgard

@sulit

Why?

Your EoD was essentially a vote that pushed a town wagon away from an unknown, and not much else beyond that. I still think Mole is scum, and you didn’t seem to have much interest in the outcome of the day.

Ample reason to vote you.

@Vulgard

I don’t actually expect to get killed this game basically ever unless I’m on the mark, so yeah, I’m gonna be here for a while, I suppose.

@Vulgard

If I get yeeted today, consider this my legacy. Not sure how correct my reads are, I haven’t really tried extremely hard. Not enough time to do it.

@Vulgard

Or I’m just making up excuses for my mediocre play, that’s also possible.

@Vulgard

Vote stays on Sulit . I think she’s been going under the radar this game. Her EoD isn’t very good, her posting has been underwhelming, and she doesn’t really seem to have interest in solving.

Do some of these things apply to me? Yes. Maybe even all of them.
Do I care? No.

@Vulgard

@Arete

|Elephas|Leafia, CallMeIo, SirDerpsAlot|3/7

And the other top wagon is my top townread.
This game is going to hell.

@Vulgard

This place is a mess. There is no towncore and no cooperation, everyone is still just doing their own thing. Can you all just… stop going after each other and start trying to find town for a moment, and sort out disagreements?

@Vulgard

I don’t give a fuck if you wolfread me, I just want you to do anything other than pushing your wolfreads, because that’s not going to work when everyone has different wolfreads.

@Vulgard

Low WiM (possibly a PR thing to fake), very “safe” play, and generally townread enough to not receive a CFD to the face at EoD by accident. I think these conditions were all fulfilled, which made kat a potential PR.

@Vulgard

@CallMeIo

Ok I’ll play along.

I ”Motion Detected Elephas.

This post does it for me, Io is town.
Will explain reasoning if anybody wants me to.

@Vulgard

There is no way a wolf enters the thread, sees the JOAT cover idea criticized by people who are probably villagers, then… performs JOAT cover as if no negative sentiment has ever existed. Openly breaking a notion established by the village for absolutely no reason isn’t something most wolves would ever do.

Which, to me, implies that Io is just town who is doing their own thing and doesn’t care.

@Vulgard

Initially scumreads Mole, but when there is actual pressure on Mole, she switches her read to a townread because “Mole is town despite what people are saying, and his post on Leafia is good.”

@Vulgard

Here.

@Vulgard

Immediately assumes that Kat was an SPK despite having self-admitted low WiM, and a significantly lower postcount than many of the other players.

Seems like an opportunity to push agenda.

@Vulgard

I’m not reading Flameo, because they are fixated on tunneling me and asking people questions, for the most part. When they do something else, I might re-evaluate my read on them. I don’t feel like wasting time on that slot right now.

@Vulgard

You voted. By popping, casting a vote on the top wagon (which eventually flipped town) and then dipping. Wolfy way to cast a vote because it avoids responsibility. Nobody is going to care about a single vote on a wagon which is already big, right? Right.

That’s why I find it wolfy. And also because I find Mole scummy, and your progression on him convenient + opportunistic, but that’s another thing.

God I honestly don’t know about Vulgard

Like some comments and frustrations they remark about in the thread feel towny to me, like them being upset about kat’s meta read on me, their complaining that this is primarily a NA game and there’s not a lot people around to talk them, them being frustrated about how the thread is disorganized, their confusion on reading katze and wishing they were easier to read, but their read and push on me is just so, so weird.

First read on Derps feels a bit weird, Vul knows Derps can play scum and I think it’s kind of weird they townread them that quickly.

I feel like their read on Io is also weird and could be w/w but I’m not gonna push on that. Just whenever I thought about Io’s slot LHF doesn’t really come to mind. Their first couple posts felt really faked to me and I think it’s obvious they kind of know what they’re doing. They say they might change their mind on Io if they keep being underwhelming but never really reeval them and I just don’t really understand this read. If one of them flip W I would look hard at the other.

Their push on Flameo is eh, don’t really like how they basically go hard on them for one post and don’t really look outside of that one post, then don’t talk to them because Flameo scumread them.

They mention finding Leafia weird but I can’t really find anywhere else they talk about or further look at Leafia, other than maybe adding them to their lynch pool.

found these posts particularly scummy

"Vote stays on Sulit . I think she’s been going under the radar this game. Her EoD isn’t very good, her posting has been underwhelming, and she doesn’t really seem to have interest in solving.

Do some of these things apply to me? Yes. Maybe even all of them.
Do I care? No."

“Low WiM (possibly a PR thing to fake), very “safe” play, and generally townread enough to not receive a CFD to the face at EoD by accident. I think these conditions were all fulfilled, which made kat a potential PR.”

They anticipate kat reading them as wolf and burying them?

They spend a couple posts just going on about how their reads might not be correct and it’s just weird.

The thing I find most weird is their push on me as stated above. They start off with a townread on me, one strong enough to put me in a towncore but rescind it referencing an alt game I played. I tell Vulgard this was an alt game and I was purposely playing differently, and they acknowledge that and keep pushing me anyways. They post a few posts near EOD acknowledging that ash was scummy, but then they quote my vote, ignoring the reasoning and say my vote… is scummy. They misrepresent my vote as “a vote that pushed a town wagon away from an unknown,” even though I had reasoning behind my vote and they acknowledged earlier at EOD as well ash was off. They shade me for assuming that Kat was killed for reads even though I did read back. They shed my ash vote in the worst light possible, saying I voted a top wagon and dipped even though I provided reasoning for my vote and wasn’t here EOD.

So yeah. There’s a lot of things Vulgard’s done this match that feel off to me. Even though they’ve posted a couple things that have pinged me as town, I think the scummy stuff overrides that.

@Flameo

[sulit]

gonna ISO Mole again then take a nap because tired

[Flameo]

Don’t forget to cast a vote!

[sulit]

im not as invested in this game as I should be because im in two other games rn on top of I have stuff going on irl

which was probably a terrible idea to do in hindsight

but

yeet

[SirDerpsAlot]

@Flameo

So lynch pool: Mole/Vulgard/Io/Gorta

Gorta tonaly is town.

Lo is a JOAT claim

Vul is Imo likely town. I always despise his reasoning but the way he plays as scum is just different

Also he has a tendency to be more confident with bad reads and less confident when his reads are good it’s kinda weird

Mole is mostly gut and tone