Virtuous Setup Balance Talk

Demon games are quite obvious and logs will just out you if you use this.

Not sure about that. There’s no distinction between “getting attacked from an outside source” and “getting attacked by the player you’re visiting” when it comes to the results you receive. It just says that you died.

But like I said, the PGO might not even be necessary, really. I do think my minor buffs should take effect, though. It’s mostly quality-of-life.

Thinking this should be able to find the Arbiter/Visionary. Marshal, as a guaranteed PR, should probably have some advantage over other investigatives. Being able to find the wolf converter with this ability seems like a good idea. It’s already encouraged to use it first because it’s essentially the same thing as the regular cop, except it tells you the exact wolf class you’re investigating. Meaning, you lose no utility and gain some. Might as well make it possible to find the wolf converter using this, right?

One problem I see with this is the ability to generate massive swing. If you find Arbiter night 1, for example, it’s most likely a big issue for the wolves. But that’s why it’s up for debate.

Quality of life change – I think the wording here is weird. Maybe it should say this?

Expert Investigation (Night) - Learn if a player is a member of the Blue Dragon or the Hand of Byzantium. - Infinite uses

I think it’s easier to understand that way, while retaining the same functionality. The idea is that you can’t find a neutral with this, but you can find groupscum. I don’t think this rewording changes the meaning.

Should absolutely see Visionary/Arbiter visits, no question. I thought it already could, to be honest. Same with Peerless Confidant, which is essentially the same thing but on two players.

If my proposed change to Case Closed is accepted, this should be reworded.

Tireless (Passive) - If you do not perform an action at night, you will learn if any of your previous uses of Expert Investigation showed incorrect results and which ones were incorrect.

The only reason it included Case Closed beforehand was that Case Closed couldn’t find the Visionary/Arbiter. I think that’s how it was.

More stuff.

Just a thought, but maybe we could extend this to two messages? Or three? This is the Exiled, by the way. Especially Letter with no Sender feels underpowered if you can only use it once per day.

The night after using Piety. I think that was the intended effect, but the wording is kinda weird.

I don’t like how confirmable this is at the moment. Should probably be reworked. Illusionist is not a Prestige class and should not be able to prove itself with trivial ease like this.

Everyone else. With the current wording, you are also preventing yourself, which prevents you from preventing others… endless cycle.

Does this include conversion? Should probably be rewritten.

Dark Rune (Night) – Protect a player from negative effects. They include occupation, redirection, and conversion. (Bleeding? Bounty? Being easier to lynch? (Judge, Archduke) What about that stuff?)

Isn’t the current delay in ToL one night, not two? Meaning, it should kill in the same cycle? I wonder if it should be like this here too. Also, does the King get notified? It should probably be included in the description.

I’ll try to figure something out for the Illusionist tomorrow. The easier thing to do is to buff it and make it a Prestige class, but that increases the percentage of Prestige classes within the rand and might be kinda bad. The more difficult thing to do is to make it difficult to confirm despite being a social class, which generally have an easier time confirming themselves.

You could consider only making this ability available N2 or N3.

“Usable N3 onwards?” Or “N2 onwards?” Thinking N3 might be too late if the game has lots of wolf KP, for instance.

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@N.1 what if the next virtuous was the Unseen/Cult trying to overthrow the Seen?

@Amelia is making a game now where the Cult is the uninformed majority.
I tried and failed earlier.

what if you did LSOTV triple threat :eyes:

i could help host cuz those are quite a bit

Lol wow

Can confirm, working on BD classes right now :eyes:

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marSHAL NO

Marshal Y E S

Then I suggest N2. Makes it more consistent too which is another positive.

Yeah you are right that FoL games are typically a bit shorter than ToL

The problem is that they decide that there is one too many killer type claims and they are correct about that, just the wrong guys as the days goes on and more killer types shows up