Bussing teammates without consent

#21

As I’ve said multiple times already, everything will be judged on a case-by-case basis, and all of this is predicated on the fact that the person who got bussed felt like you were gamethrowing and reported you.
As I’ve said, nobody will get punished for jumping on a wagon. Purposely creating a wagon for cred is where the whole thing gets infinitely more dicey, and in those cases we’d rather err on the side of caution and make sure the person who’s getting bussed knows what’s happening to them – explicitly.

If another person claims to be a Sheriff/Observer, for example, who saw that your faction member is scum and they get voted up, and it seems as if they’re about to get executed and you piggyback on that, that seems to be fine (though personally if I was in that game I’d be suspicious of someone making a play like that because it seems precisely like trying to piggyback for cred).

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#22

Also can make a sheriff claim as unseen very hard to play , after 3-4 turns you need to give something up , if you are mm its even more important to give something up .

Beginning of a new day and someone starts questioning your claim , you might have to act quick and throw someone under the bus before you have time to converse . As MM its vital that you don’t go down and if that means giving up a legit claim to the table you shouldn’t have to whisper your underlings to get permission first .

#23

I honestly don’t understand this mindset - if you’re 3 or 4 nights in, you’ve had plenty of time to talk to your faction members and arrange something. If you want to do an “I’m Sheriff, I have my scout on X and they got converted last night” play, you can delay it by one night to let them know. The only time you’d get called out for something like that is if an actual Sheriff also had a Scout on them and it didn’t trigger when you claimed it did - and the chances of that happening are low, they’d need to have placed the Scout on the person the day after you converted them. If they already had a Scout on them when you converted, they’d yell it out immediately and you can piggyback onto that like was discussed above.

#24

This doesn’t happen, like, ever unless it’s super late game with only a few people left and you’ve been claiming Sheriff and producing no or few results the entire time, and if it’s that late in the game you’ve had time to talk to the other Unseen member about bussing them, without resorting to bussing a freshly converted person who you didn’t have a night chat with yet.

#25

I certainly watch sheriff claims and will start to get very suspicious of any that have either completely failed to find anybody for 4-5 turns and will call them out on it .
If someone claims investigative class I expect results !!

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#26

Sheriff whiffing on multiple nights can easily happen, especially if they investigated the Mastermind the first 3 nights, were jailed, occupied, redirected, or plenty of other things. A competent Mastermind can easily fake a Sheriff will that has 4-5 N/Ses, with weaving in fake occupations, people who died, and other things. You can get suspicious of people who don’t have results, but that suspicion can easily be incorrect.

#27

yeah I am talking about the turn 4-7 sheriffs with ever decreasing circles producing no results . Combining with Sherriff gets converted a lot id be leaning towards turning on a sheriff that kept missing .

#28

it’s not gamethrowing but it’s definitely a dick move

#29

What’s with the Evil King? They cannot safely ask their teammates if a bus is OK.

#30

I’ve both spontaneously bussed and been bussed and I always had the bussed person realize what was happening and play along. It’s surprising satisfying when it happens on the spot. Remember that a gamethrowing Evil will also out THEMSELVES as evil and not just the bussed person.

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#31

As i explained in my merc post, i think those VERY special rules need to be displayed VERY clearly whitin the game. In every single other mafia games i have played, bussing is an extremely common strategy.

I come from a site called epic mafia where they have some of the best players, and bussing is extremely common.

If you are going to warn/ban people for doing a classic mafia/werewolf strategy, it should be displayed very clearly.

And quite honneslty, i think all those rules which are trying to stop advanced level of play is bad for the health of the game. There is a difference between stupidly outting all of your team because you are salty, and throwing a partner under the buss to give yourself more credibility. But if we’re constantly fearing a ban, then we will avoid this kind of next level play.

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#32

Honestly, if there is any game where bussing is a good idea it is this one because of the conversation mechanic

#33

That’s a very good point. I have often bussed my cult partners knowing full well they were cult just to give myself some credibility as evil king. I did that whitout their consent. Should i be banned?

#34

I’ve accidently bussed the last cult before. I was kinda screwed as I couldn’t lynch out all the BD before I lost.

#35

I don’t get what is so hard to understand what Methnor is trying to say. You’re all trying to find ways to argue a simple rule that is more than straight up and simple.

Don’t bus your team mates without the proper communication. Not every one is well informed of tactics in this game and you may end up being put into the Cult or Unseen with somebody you don’t know.

Communicate with them, don’t jump the gun and assume they know.

There are times where I’m Cult Leader or Assassin and after there is at least 1 conversion, I always at some point say “Claim an Investigative and reveal me, keep converting, get numbers” and that works for most of the time. Maybe you guys should try that sometime.

But please, for the love of all that is apple pie, just accept the rule and stop trying to argue it. It’s not healthy.

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#36

And when you don’t have time to coordinate it? One of the times I bussed someone in a way that would get me killed if I did it any later and it was on a fresh convert. No time to plan with them and no time to ask. Same happened one of the time I was bussed Except it was the new convert doing the bussing on me. Same deal as before.

#37

We understand the rule. But i think we’re allowed to disagree with it. This game is still very new, and i think rules will most likely change in time.

I have been playing mafia/werewolf games for many years, and its the first time i see a rule about bussing being illegal. Its a very legitimate and basic strategy used in those game types. And of course, its most often not done with the person’s consent.

Same goes for the mercenary rule. It makes absolutly no sense to force mercenaries to not play by their own win condition.

I think its healhy to discuss rules and possibly have them changed. Seems like the huge majority of the community thinks bussing should be allowed in the game. Bussing is usually done on the spot, its not a planned thing. I think it just takes mods some common sense to see the difference between a buss that went wrong, and someone who purposely tryed to lose the game.

#38

We’ve had so many reports where people have been bussed and then outted the entire faction because they were uninformed and not communicated with.

It has started to lead to game-throwing reports by both sides of the team.

The Mastermind reporting the Assassin for revealing all the Unseen.
The Assassin reporting the Mastermind for throwing him under the bus.

I’m not kidding, we get at least 5 of these reports a day. It’s like Methnor said before, there are new players to the game and to the genre and throwing them in the deep-end doesn’t seem fair. It’s best we nip it in the bud. Perhaps when we get a competitive system and the more experienced players start joining up, then yeah, perhaps bussing will be a more active strategy. But until that happens, it’s like I said, nipping it in the bud.

#39

That sounds like a learning curve problem. Not what the rules are supposed to address. It would be better to simply mention bandwagoning as spacificaly NOT an example of gamethrowing to make the assassin in this case have no excuse.

#40

Just to clarify. We have not said bussing is not allowed. We’re saying communicate.

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