Evil King Throws

#1

so we’ve already determined that an Unseen/Cult can not bus a teammate in order to appear to be BD without that teammates permission. That’s considered against the rules. I just had an Evil King that outed me as cult after a n2 check. When he eventually died he told me it was so he would appear as good king to BD. That has to be just as much against the rules. Since evil king is ALLIED with cult, they are teammates. If Unseen cant out other unseen without permission to make themselves look like a sheriff, Evil king should not be able to do the same without permission to make themselves look like good king.

I understand neut king can out anybody or do whatever he wants in order to survive. But evil king’s objective is not to survive, it is for cult to win. Bussing cult to appear good king doesnt help that objective any more than unseen bussing teammates to appear sheriff helps them reach their objective.

It was day 2 exe, so i didn’t stick around through a 2 hour cult game to report him, but I did wanna hop on here and make sure that that is indeed reportable.

#2

It shouldn’t be, as he literally can’t communicate with you beforehand.

I’d say that he should whisper you first, but with Maid Spy that is no longer an option. So what he did should be entirely within the rules.

#3

False. An evil king is more valuable than any unseen/Cult member except for MM so long as it isn’t the last member of the cult or if the MM is still alive. This is because an evil king means that you have 4/5 total members plus his extra vote/decide fate. For a total of 5/6 votes.

#4

Well first of all, while I don’t agree with their stance… on the whole they’ve never outright said bussing your team-mates without concent is always gamethrowing. They’ve kept the rules vague, and more or less said “you should get concent”, and all of the examples they’ve given, were ones in which the person bussing had a chance in night chat to talk with his teammates, yet chose not to (even though it’s clear he had already made the decision to bus before talking with his teammates, thus conciously chose not to use his freely available uncompromizable discussion medium before bussing). They’ve effectively avoided giving a quote one way or the other on cases in which communication is not possible (say doing it in reaction to knowing a butler just found the assasain, or bussing a member that was jailed last night etc…). Evil king falls into that grey area… as he not only can’t safely communicate with unseen/cult members, but the starting one can’t even know whether someone is an unseen or a scorned target/fool.

#5

You also have to remember - A cult/unseen result for an Evil King could be a Fool or a scorned target

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#6

This whole bussing rule of pathetic. You get outted to save another evil. Deal with it. Stop crying like a bitch. You shouldn’t need permission. Get better at the game and understand why it happens. You are a pawn in the king or leaders game.

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#7

Agreed. While I support the idea of coordinating with your team when possible, bussing is an important tactic, and needs to be able to be used without worrying about reports. It’s up to each individual to play their side as best they can. Bussing is little different than the decision to try to defend your MM at trial, or let him get hung. You have a very limited window to decide if BD is really hot to hang him, or if they have enough real info and decide to either try to support him or try to score extra points with BD. If he says butler, and he occ’d you, saying he’s lying is the same as bussing. It’s also very tactically sound to do so, if you think he’s going down one way or the other. Deception is not something that can be divided into black and white.

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#8

Bussing V Gamethrowing
-Bussing, “princess here, 3(Your servant) is offensive/killer. Should we get a claim?”
-Gamethrowing, “Ugh 2 is MM I’m assassin, such a trash class”

see the difference?

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#9

Sounds like what Noz would do :thinking::thought_balloon:

#10

Listen guys. All I’m arguing is that I think it should be consistent. Either evil king and unseen/cult BOTH need permission, or nobody needs permission. Idc which way it is tbh. Just pushing to make it a uniform rule.

However I understand the argument that evil guys can discuss at night and plan that kind of stuff but king would have to risk whispering during the day. So it’d be too hard for him to get permission. Anyway guys I just wanted to discuss it no need to call me a cry baby or bitch or whatever.

#11

Yeah I get you there, The long and short of it from how I interpreted the dev’s examples etc… isn’t that it is gamethrowing to bus a teammate without his permission, but that it is frowned upon if you both were in the night chat, and you must have already made the decision, not to use the time there to inform him of your intentions.

if you look back on those threads, while people like myself used examples of assasain being in jail etc… the dev’s avoided touching any of the concepts of which one or both parties could not be in night chat.