Fixing Neutral Killers

Feedback/Suggestions
#1

One of the devs posted this on Reddit about NKs:

Reaper’s win rate is fine as is.

Possessor just needs a minor buff.

Sorc and Inq need worked on in general.

Regarding those last two, could we just give Possessor a third use of Possess again? And what about removing Sorc’s ability to hide from Inq and instead giving her 4 uses of day abilities to hide from Blue Dragon ONLY?

Also would be nice to let Reaper use chill before anyone can chat at the beginning of the day, and also have the Possessor facelift and deathnote bugs fixed. Sometimes when you jump, the notification says “12 was a Hunter” but in the list of players at the bottom right, it lists 12 as something other than a Hunter. And often my updated deathnote is not shown when I jump.

#2

The problem for Possessor is that he doesn’t scale into lategame. If it’s him vs 3 people, he’ll still often lose, since everyone will make passwords and do fancy confirmable things. When the Reaper’s down to four or five people, he just straight out wins, and if the sorc can keep the evils alive til’ then, they can call numbers. Giving Poss another use of Possess doesn’t change the fact that he has trouble closing out the game; he needs something more to help him out at the end, such as the ability to become PK more easily, or get similar bonuses for possessing the king/prince.

1 Like
#3

Yeah I think Possessor needs to be thoroughly bugfixed and then looked at.

I agree that Reaper is fine. If anything, I would be okay with a Reaper rework because I just dislike the reaping mechanic (not the soul mechanic, though, that one is actually really interesting). But that’s just my personal opinion. If the devs like it as-is, fine by me.

Sorc and Inq I feel should have a bit more depth. Circle of Death is pretty great but Magic Missile is kind of meh. I honestly wouldn’t mind capping the victims of the Circle of Death to 1 or 2 and making it infinite uses (with some other limitation perhaps?). Inquisitor really shouldn’t be able to yolo N1, I feel that’s pretty unwise for a BD-aligned class. And even if you luck out and get the Sorc n1, you’re still getting executed to make sure you’re not a Possessor.

All in all, the Inq and Sorc need more diverse abilities.

#4

Inquisitor isn’t BD-aligned. He’s anti sorc. I yolo nights 1-3 and hope that bd catches the sorc if I don’t kill him. It’s because I simply don’t care about BD winning, but killing them darn BD’s makes it more likely that they’ll vote up and kill the sorc by pure chance. Letting the Sorc’s attacks kill BD was, in my opinion, a big improvement, since he’s no longer quite so loved by BD

1 Like
#5

“Sorc attacks”

:slight_smile:

2 Likes
#6

The Inquisitor loses if BD loses and the Sorc is still alive. You aren’t explicitly BD aligned like the Mercenary, but it’s a lot closer than a class like the Alchemist.

1 Like
#7

And what it would change? He can even have unlimited uses and issues will remain.

What about generally implement some tweak in Inquisitor and Sorcerer? This is clearly not enough.

1 Like
#8

I mean as inquistor you stab sorc

Cc the hunter claim and vote them up

And get MVP

1 Like
#9

Honestly the best Sorcerer buff is to just remove Inquisitor

3 Likes
#10

I like how we already tried this.

#11

How well did it work?

Prob not that well…

#12

Sorc really doesn’t need a buff though.

#13

…

Sorc dying N1 isn’t buff worthy?

#14

Everyone dies n1. My point was more that last I heard, Sorc had the best winrate of the NK’s at around 15%. Has it dropped recently? And if you removed the Inquisitor, idek what Sorc’s new winrate would be, but I’m guessing “hella high” would be an accurate description.

#15

Inquistor stabbing the sorc N1 isn’t actually fun and shouldn’t happen.

2 Likes
#16

The problem for Possessor is that he doesn’t scale into lategame. If it’s him vs 3 people, he’ll still often lose, since everyone will make passwords and do fancy confirmable things.

I’ve never thought that a problem. Posswords don’t work all the time (they only work if possessor did not successfully puppet string someone), and jumping into a non-suspicious and non-confirmable target is part of being a smart possessor.

And what it would change? He can even have unlimited uses and issues will remain.

I thought Poss was perfectly fine when he had 3 uses of Posses, apart from the Psychic dead communication issue and the deathnote and facelift bugs.

#17

Passwords always work for the unseen/cult; I have yet to lose a lategame to a possessor as an evil faction.

It is true that passwords are not as effective for BD, but they become totally viable if a mystic or a prince is still alive (but honestly, if the prince is still alive, any NK is going to be in trouble). If the king has enough guards, he’ll just work his way through bd, exing them one by one and guarding himself at night, being confirmed with a finger every day (once again, this is a problem that reaper doesn’t have and sorc can bypass if the cult are still alive). A Knight has a decent chance of killing you as you jump, but you can also make him kill a BD, so no biggie. If phys heals one of your attacks (not a jump), not only is the phys confirmed, but so is the person you attacked, and they have a decent chance of killing you. Noble’s always day confirmable. I imagine that I could list a few more, but I think you get the picture. Lategame, there’s a lot of stuff that can screw you over as the poss, even if you survive the early game.

#18

All I can say is my favorite endgame scenario is 2 people and a poss. My most memorable game was like that. Never found those things you mention to be such an enormous deal.

#19

you could fix that by allowing the possessor to see previous whispers of those he targets

#20

btw I have found that possessor is actually the strongest NK but also has the highest skill floor. He has a huge amount of potential but most people who roll him are not skilled enough to take advantage of it and end up being obvious.

Not saying he doesn’t need buffs but that should at least show that the buffs should be something more minor that nudges players in the right direction. Like something investigative or offensive instead of social.

1 Like