[FM] Mafia Academy 1 - Mafia Victory

[Firekitten]

I have no clue man

[Marshal]

Give an approximation.

[Firekitten]

There’s a case that it isn’t and there’s a case it is

Angle shooting is a weird rule if you think about it

[Marshal]

At least I think an approximation isn’t bad. I don’t know but I already said it so yeah.

[Firekitten]

like

It’s technically part of the game

[Nerbins]

Like maybe 30 minutes
No it was 20 minutes

[Mercenary]

You could have said “I voted” but not who
it would be valid I think

[Firekitten]

@Marshal

we need to have some form of vote cohesion as there are probably a solid unmoveable 3-4 votes on me and if we split everything everywhere i will end up being the lynch.

so around here is when you voted right marshal

[Arete]

I don’t know if I’m allowed to give exact times but the thing that tipped me over the line to a Priestess vote rather than not that was this exchange (I might’ve voted her either way, but the exchange is why I didn’t wait any longer).

@Arete

Can you explain why you assumed Geyde/Luxy were trying to mislynch you, rather than them just being wrong?

@anon97870008

Because I’m their highest scumread. Normally they put me in “yeah really scummy, but don’t lynch yet it could be town”, because they legit know that I’m one of the hardest to read on this site

Going to catch up on other parts of the thread now/take that additional look at FK/Katze like I said.

[Marshal]

Approximately, yes. A little after.

[Geyde]

Maxwell

Maxwell:

All of their posts tangentially move gamestate forward in a positive way

@Maxwell

How many town collapses due to mechanical talk and people getting “confirmed” will it take you to learn that the best strategy is almost always reading people from ISO’s, interactions, and self meta? I might be wrong, but it feels like the VFM town winrates on this site are much higher than winrates in almost every other category of FM.

@Maxwell

Please don’t become too set on your towncore too fast as Vul did in SFoL 00. Although townhunting instead of scumhunting can be a good strategy, I prefer the latter because if a scum member gets into your towncore and you don’t expel them before it is too late, that can screw with everything.

@Maxwell

I agree with a good deal of this post. It’s a bit unfortunate that so many people try so little as scum here and that reading via self meta is so effective.

Shurian:

@Maxwell

Comment on this: Self meta reading and ISOwall analysis is a good strategy on this site but it shouldn’t be as good as it is, and making people squirm and uncomfortable is still the best way at nailing the scum just as it is everywhere else. I had the most posts in Marson despite subbing in but all my work didn’t really help in getting the scum compared to what others did in a whole lot less.

@Maxwell

Like seriously, fuck this meta.
I’ve been bogged down with school and IRL commitments and am extremely tired, but day 2 I absolutely am going to forfeit my vote to produce meaningful interactions.

Their d2 has been shit, but reasonable since their d1 left much to be desired
Their roleclaim is anti-town and contradictory given their earlier stance on roleclaims. Blatant so it’s NAI.

---

DatBird

@eevee-samaBird

Not a Wall I Swear

@PokemonKidRyan

This game is gonna be so stressful for my because:

1. Never Hydra’d before.
2. Never been this role.
3. Have a terrible PR and I’m getting stressed over it. I just hope that Priestess can help me where I cannot help as much.

Post count: 1/20.

But luckily got a role which should be great and super testing of my ability to both

1. Work with Priestess
2. Read on a similar page to her.

@Simon

Hm. getting a scumread off this, weird as it is.
pkr claiming pr, which makes me just initially wary as a precaution (but is not AI in and of itself)

@katze

I think this post is too much information to be giving out if you were a PR

So catching up, and I noticed two people scumreading/shading PKR for saying pr. When I think he means post restriction and from how I read their statements it seems like they are thinking power role. Thats a problem with acronyms so I want to ask the three of them to make sure Im reading this right, and dont worry I know we all have post restrictions so when you guys do your next post I want to ask, What did you all mean by PR in these three posts @PokemonKidRyan , @Simon , @katze

@Nerbins

I skimmed my rolecard earlier and didn’t initially notice my post limit and assumed my class was normal. I can’t post too much but the consequence isn’t too bad so if necessary I’ll break it. Won’t say exact number or consequence for fear of claim-vig

I never understood the logic of not looking at your card before posting, your actively hurting yourself if you dont. Gut says bad.

@Simon

it might, but it might not. personally i think its in town’s interest to try and keep it a secret who they’re voting. it would give us some clearer insights into people’s motivations.

I want to say I disagree with this post, since we shouldnt hide information, but im so baffled on how stating votes work with

@eevee-sama

All direct claims “/vote ABC” or “I’m voting ABC” or “I’m voting my highest scumread” are allowed.
You need to find a way to convince and pressure others without using votes.
Each time I notice someone claiming theirs vote in some way, something bad will happen.

cause it says saying that is legal, but it also punishes. But we need to convince others without votes. Cause punishments. So I think by this post we cant state it at all, but I feel like then we are so much more uncoordinated, which is eactly what we dont want

THIRTY WALLPOST LATER. my eyes hurt

@Jane

I’ll do the meta-read on Marshal tomorrow, for now I’ll read other people.

interesting that he doesnt immediatly do the read on the person that wants him dead so much. Gonna look forward to this post tomorrow

@PoisonedSquid

Does Simon focus more on mechanics as Town?
Does he tend to stray away from mechanics as Scum?

Mechanics talk isn’t really a townie thing unless certain things say otherwise, but can you explain your read on him a bit more?

from my knowledge he does both iirc. But its been so long and I cant really pin point a simon scum game to make comparisons to

@anon97870008

7. DatBird (0) -

Hey @anon97870008 trying to understand your post some more, what do all the numbers next to the names mean?

@anon97870008

Hi OMGUS, I’m Dad

ftfy

@Mercenary

N0 peek:
MaximusPrime

Do you have a N0 peek?

Merc… :^)

@Mercenary

I don’t think Eevee would design a role that encourages slanking. To make it clear I already think the PRs were not randed and that they are designed for each player.
Our post restrictions just try to have us write more informative posts, but that… Unless he planned to get Kai to wallpost somehow.

I agree and then I look at Marshal who is the one blacksheep who doesnt have a post restriction. Now i think for the most part this makes sense, but Marshals non post restriction class confuses me, unless there are others like him.

@Mistyx

I think PKR claiming a PR in his first post was wolfy for him

Again someone who is sring him for that. Im pretty sure he meant post restriction

@Mistyx

@Mistyx did you check with preistes before posting that?

Yes, I checked with the person who I do not share a private chat with, and have not interacted in-thread with yet

@Marshal

hmm calm down it was a reactiontest.

I don’t really get anything from this because it was cpmromised but ah well.

@Mistyx

What exactly is there to gain from that test

Honestly dont like this interaction with Marshal. He did something obviously wrong (basically a Meteoro I have a redcheck on you, or HTM why are you scum) and wasted people who have post restriction (or at least imma assume they do, cause everyone else but Marshal claimed they did) posts by saying oh its a reaction test, and the most he was going to get was

@Marshal

scumslipping you + jgoes/preistess

like i dont see anywhere a player would fall for this and give you a scumslip honestly. Not liking this interaction.

@PokemonKidRyan

PKR’s longest wallpost ever

god damn it. Most of it was boring af, sorry but walls are slowly killing my mood as i make one myself

@Arete

Except that you aren’t looking at people’s reasons for reading you as scum or him as town, you’re just attacking everyone who does and acting like the only reason they could have for doing that is being scum, which isn’t true even if you’re town and Jgoes is scum . You aren’t evaluating their thought process at all, which is what actually matters here.

I really like this post into the trs for you

@eevee-samaBird

Ok yall, Imma catch up while doing some design homework

I didnt get to do half the work this is taking to long

@Mercenary

You guys can try to do it like me and only read the most recent posts, since you usually get the context as people keep repeating it anyway lol

Nah I would rather be fully informed

@Maxwell

I am commiting to avoiding mechanical talk completely in this game if at all possible. This means that I will never reveal any information whatsoever from my classcard, period.

Im proud of ya

@Maxwell

I’m also a bit disappointed that it seems a decent amount of people are sheeping some of the same town and scumreads.

can you further elaborate on who you think is sheeping

@Mercenary

I hate this

@JakeTheWolfie

Here are my thoughts on the whole Marshal/Jgoes situation:

At some times, it feels like Marshal is scum.
At other times, the inverse seems true.

Could it be that Marshal v Jgoes is TvT?

Honestly theres been so much discussion on it, but honestly everyones pretty much said this has been TvS. I would love for people to reread it now and see if their opinions have changed. Atm I think im the same situation as you, where they both have been scummy and both have been town in other aspects, and I havent placed one into either scum or town yet.

Now for the rest of this mega post. Im not ready… Imma give it a rest for now… I have work due in a hour and a half that I ahve put off due to this.
3/50

@eevee-samaBird

@Simon

but that post count. 20. hm.
first, are you counting priestess in that? because she posted once before this

To answer ur question Priestess already talked on this below

@anon97870008

I’m the newbie in our hydra, so I have a way higher post restriction than him, so expect me to sometimes letting him speak through me.

So from my guessing each hydra head has it’s own post count, with some heads having more or less posts.

@Luxy

So Geyde and I have observed the thread since the game started and we’ve gathered some interesting information in regards to the alignment of players. Please read this entire post, I tried to format it in the most accessible way.

I really like this post honestly. A lot of work and thought went into it, and I’m reading their slot as town for now.
1/50

I look at the Priestess push on them and then I don’t see any actual votes on them at EoD
EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEHHHHHHHHHHHHH
It’s kinda townie but then I look at post count and reading this slot is actually painful beyond vague associations with other players

I don’t see stretching with my TRs other than exactly Kai

@firekitten

@geyde this isn’t OOGI right

like, it’s part of the game right

Don’t ask me
I’m not hosting this

Mercenary

@Mercenary

Most of it are weak arguments that aren’t AI even being scummy behavior (townies often act on scummy behavior because they simply don’t care how they will be read). I also feel that LuxyGey only pointed at my bad points not considering the good ones or trying to see what was my thought line at the time.

@disquieted

• Mercenary had an awkward movement around Marshal/Jgoes, which is quite, quite valid.
• Mercenary doesn’t consider Jgoes as town, and it’s called agenda pushing. Slightly reachy, town can do that as well.
• Disagreement of scumreads is partially invalid, but given scum need to find a defendable position after a bad lynch and I’d reason a relatively bad nightkill that really does imply the kill was blocked at this point it’s… a fine point. I resonate about the 1 scum in a six person PoE, it’s a pretty big net to drag around and it implies a lot of associations - generally when you make a PoE you just lump everyone in and kill mafia inside, not think about how many they are. Luxy’s point because of it is quite valid.
• Lack of clearing people is… ok, it’s not smoking but it’s definitely somewhat indicative. Lack of Marshal vs Priestess is quite valid. Rigid mindset is definitely valid.
• IIoA is valid.
• Bad placement of Priestess is valid, lack of progression is valid. It’s quite intriguing to be honest, and requires independent investigation if only because that sort of thing is powerful.
• Shade and chainsaw is not incredibly valid. Probably more valid given it’s on Luxy/Geyde, to be honest. The bolded statement is powerful.
• Hedge is valid.
• Shrug at Geyde’s push, it’s not terribly indicative, as you can tell I’ve been ignoring pushes all game for one.

@Mercenary

What is an individual level?

Their ISO exclusively
Vacuum with no other players

@Mercenary

I believe that PKRiestess was a easy wagon to jump into as a bus, as it wouldn’t see the light of life at D2 even if it survived D1, and would just make the people who voted the counterwagon Nerbins above it more suspicious. Beforehand I thought that almost all scum were invested in the Nerbins wagon, but rethinking stuff it would be more benefitial to them not to try to salvage PKRiestess’ slot.

@Mercenary

I’m fair with we having different reads, I just think that pushing me for it is too much.
Which one of them do you want to know about?

Vul
Dat
Kai
Arete

[Nerbins]

@MaximusPrime
Please answer me. Did you get a fruit last night?

[Firekitten]

After a little reading of what was happening when they voted, I think the wagon is pure

[Firekitten]

@Geyde

Don’t ask me
I’m not hosting this

yeah but like we should know what the rules of angle shooting are

but we don’t

[Firekitten]

Datbird hasn’t really done anything today or commented on anything, all he has done today was talk about Fruit Vendors as a potential role.

@DatBird can you do something

[astand]

Alright, I don’t have too much time to play right now, and I won’t be present at EoD.

I hardclaim cop with a condition (it’s not really relevant) and I have a RED peek on Firekitten/katze.

I checked them as I was leaning scum on them, but wasn’t too sure and feared it could be difficult to pin FK down later on if he’s really mafia. I pretended to not have any peeks and pressured the slot for a bit to make them speak more, which I guess succeeded, albeit the usefulness of FK’s spew today might be somewhat dubious.

FK’s initial play this game boils down to trying very hard to discredit Marshal both yesterday AND today, which makes Marshal pretty much locktown (and it’s not difficult to see why FK’s scum mindset was preoccupied with things like possible neutral killers).
After he broke his post restriction (I suspect it’s real btw, as I really don’t believe FK would create an excuse for himself to post less), he is just pretty much going without any actual direction whatsoever in this game, as he tries to make an appearances of pushing/testing people only to abandon them minute after without conclusion or follow up.
Katze clearly showed that he had no consistent thoughts about Marshal today, since his explanation about trying to test people about his theories makes not a lick of sense. And he became more focused on fluff and defending himself today, which I think was probably due to FK coaching him (I think it’d be kinda hilarious if FK told the absolute truth when he spoke he is a control freak as scum).

My thoughts as to most likely other mafia:

I think if we look on Nerbins’ wagon, Maxwell is much more likely to flip scum. Not only he failed to produce any meaningful content whatsoever, despite talking about his role a great deal (which proves he is in fact visiting thread from time to time), but one moment I especially hated was how he popped in 1.5 hours after his last post only to point out how Alice slanked in one of her wolf games. This reads to me like very weak attempt at shading and honestly bafflingly shallow conclusion for a person who supposedly spent 12 hours researching Alice’s meta (as I do know as fact that Alice’s activity levels are NAI). Overall this post and several others ping me, as Maxwell seems to struggle entering the thread comfortably (and his role being only possible foothold for him).

As for Jake: well, I don’t believe Jake/Maxwell are very realistic as w/w (and honestly, D1 wagons would be just hilarious if so), but the fact that he openly admitted to just posting isos for townreads kinda reminds me of his silly plays in Marson game (the dude seems to have a really warped perception of how he should play as a villager, to be honest). The fact that those responses were prompted by FK also makes me think they are unlikely w/w, but that’s not as strong of a point.

Another person who I think has high wolf equity is Mercenary (whom I’m reevaluating now). I agree with the fact that their read list is bizzare, and I’ve noticed that recently they do seem to slip into their scum way of playing by shading and attacking people left and right: Marshal is shaded even though she admits he is not mafia, Vulgard is shaded for shallow reason, Luxy is shaded/discredited, and claims of Vulgard/Luxy being a coordinated push doesn’t really feel like a real thought. Overall I think Mercenary has been trending down significantly lately.

I do agree that we should take a closer look at DatBird if Mercenary is indeed scum.

From katze’s ISO and his hedgy shading on Kai’s slot D1, I think Kai is slightly more likely to be town fwiw. But eh, I’m kinda lazy to do much of a detailed analysis of it now, in relation to other people.

[astand]

@luxy @Geyde @arete @disquieted @Simon @Ami @Shurian @DatBird @Marshal @Vulgard

Fk/katze is redpeeked and they are the lynch today.

[astand]

@PoisonedSquid @SirDerpsAlot @Maxwell @JakeTheWolfie @Mercenary @MaximusPrime @Nerbins

[astand]

I demand to see some cat pictures btw, but not too many.

[Firekitten]

that’s a very great reaction test that will 100% catch me