They wouldn’t be full classcards, just list the sets and the old cult alt text can be replaced. Overall it’d just be more clearer. I have been met with a lot of confusion when hosting this and just listing all possible sets is really the easiest way to get the message across of how it works.
Details tab is a wonderful thing. I don’t know why you’re so against this. If it doesn’t resonate we simply “undo edit”.
In actuality knowing the different sets exactly, instead of looking more so at the individual abilities is a lot easier for decision-making.
#ChangeAlchWincon
It’s almost impossible to win as Alch.
You have to save 3 people from attacks… in a game which often resolves on D3 or D4.
3 Likes
Old:
The Prince
Blue Dragon Killer
Unstoppable (Passive) - You cannot be occupied at night, even by means that bypass occupy immunity. You are also immune to target changing.
Royal Blood (Passive) - Votes to become king count as two for you.
Imprison (Day) - Choose a player to jail at night occupying the target (Bypasses occupy immunity) and preventing visits to them. You both will be able to send each other a single 1000 character message through the host. - Infinite uses
Execute (Night) - Kill the player you have jailed (Bypasses night immunity and healing). If the executed is a member of the Blue Dragon, you will not be able to execute for the rest of the game. - 3 uses, available starting Night 2
Mercy (Night) - Heal the player you have jailed. If you have executed a member of Blue Dragon, this ability is disabled. - 2 uses
Your objective is to defeat the Unseen or Cult, and any neutrals that seek to do you harm.
New:
The Prince
Blue Dragon Killer
Unstoppable (Passive) - You cannot be occupied at night, even by means that bypass occupy immunity. You are also immune to target changing.
Royal Blood (Passive) - Votes to become king count as two for you.
Imprison (Day) - Choose a player to jail at night occupying the target (Bypasses occupy immunity) and preventing visits to them. You both will be able to send each other a single 1000 character message through the host. - Infinite uses
Execute (Night) - Kill the player you have jailed (Bypasses night immunity and healing). If the executed is a member of the Blue Dragon, you will not be able to execute for the rest of the game. - 3 uses
Mercy (Night) - Heal the player you have jailed. - 2 uses
Your objective is to defeat the Unseen or Cult, and any neutrals that seek to do you harm.
Old:
The Assassin
Unseen Killer
Hidden Blade (Day) - Cut your target, causing them to bleed. They will bleed and die in two nights if not healed. - 3 uses (shared)
Distract (Day) - Target player is occupied for this day. - 1 Use (shared)
Assassinate (Night) - Kill a player. - Infinite uses
2-for-1 (Night) - Kill two target players. - 1 use (shared)
Your objective is to defeat the Blue Dragon and any neutrals that seek to do you harm.
The Mastermind
Unseen Special
Can’t Touch This (Passive) - Immune to death at night, occupation and target changing. You will know if someone tries to occupy you or change your target.
Lurking Presence (Passive) - If you are killed within the first 3 nights your next in line will take your place as Mastermind, and you do not appear as Unseen to all investigations for those nights.
Dirty Work (Day) If there are no more Unseen members left, you can become The Assassin at the beginning of the night. - 1 use
Convert (Night) - Change target player into the Unseen version of their class. If you have failed to convert a target twice already and your next conversion would fail it will instead target a random convertible player. - Infinite uses, 1 night cooldown
Foresight (Night) - Determine a player’s converted class type, or if they cannot be converted. Additionally, you will know who they visit and who visits them. - 4 uses
Your objective is to defeat the Blue Dragon and any neutrals that seek to do you harm.
New:
The Assassin
Unseen Killer
Apprentice (Passive) - If the Mastermind dies or is crowned King, you will take their place. This passive will pass on to the next converted player if you are crowned King. (Starting Assassin only)
Hidden Blade (Day) - Cut your target, causing them to bleed. They will bleed and die in two nights if not healed. - 3 uses (shared)
Distract (Day) - Target player is occupied for this day. - 1 Use (shared)
Assassinate (Night) - Kill a player. - Infinite uses
2-for-1 (Night) - Kill two target players. - 1 use (shared)
Your objective is to defeat the Blue Dragon and any neutrals that seek to do you harm.
The Mastermind
Unseen Special
Can’t Touch This (Passive) - Immune to death at night, occupation and target changing. You will know if someone tries to occupy you or change your target. You do not appear as Unseen for the first 3 nights.
Dirty Work (Day) If there are no more Unseen members left, you can become The Assassin at the beginning of the night. - 1 use
Convert (Night) - Change target player into the Unseen version of their class. If you have failed to convert a target twice already and your next conversion would fail it will instead target a random convertible player. - Infinite uses, 1 night cooldown
Foresight (Night) - Determine a player’s converted class type, or if they cannot be converted. Additionally, you will know who they visit and who visits them. - 4 uses
Your objective is to defeat the Blue Dragon and any neutrals that seek to do you harm.
Old:
The Cult Leader
Cult Special
Train (Passive) - At any point before the start of the first night, you may message the host and choose the Cult alts that the Cult class that spawned with you will receive, based on a non-unique class they can be converted from. If you do not choose the Cult alts, they will receive a random valid set.
Fanaticism (Passive) - You are immune to death at night until you successfully convert a player, where upon this passive is disabled. (Starting Cult Leader only)
Disguise (Day) - If the target player dies tonight, they will appear as a class of your choice. - 1 use (shared)
Rupture (Day) - Cause a player to bleed. They will bleed and die in two nights if not healed. - 3 uses (shared)
Brainwash (Night) - Change target player into the Cult version of their class. If you have failed to convert a target twice already and your next conversion would fail it will instead target a random convertible player. - Infinite uses, 1 night cooldown
Blood of Mithras (Night) - Kill a Cult player and a non-Cult player. The first use of this will not kill the cult player. - Infinite uses
Your objective is to defeat the Blue Dragon and any neutrals that seek to do you harm.
New:
The Cult Leader
Cult Special
Train (Passive) - At any point before the start of the first night, you may message the host and choose the Cult alts that the Cult class that spawned with you will receive, based on a non-unique class they can be converted from. If you do not choose the Cult alts, they will receive a random valid set.
Fanaticism (Passive) - You are immune to death at night until you successfully convert a player, where upon this passive is disabled. (Starting Cult Leader only)
Disguise (Day) - If the target player dies tonight, they will appear as a class of your choice. - 1 use (shared)
Rupture (Day) - Cause a player to bleed. They will bleed and die in two nights if not healed. - 3 uses (shared)
Brainwash (Night) - Change target player into the Cult version of their class. If you have failed to convert a target twice already and your next conversion would fail it will instead target a random convertible player. - Infinite uses, 1 night cooldown
Blood of Mithras (Night) - Kill a Cult player and a non-Cult player. The first use of this will not kill the cult player. This ability does not visit the Cult player. - Infinite uses
Your objective is to defeat the Blue Dragon and any neutrals that seek to do you harm.
The Alchemist gets an easier wincon in no longer needing to succesfully protect their target from attacks. In addition, they are immune towards occupation and redirection.
The Inquisitor makes their glorious entrance. Beware heathen massclaimers.
The Inquisitor
Neutral Investigative
Zealous Pursuit (Passive) - You hunt three heathens. Their starting classes are [x], [x] and [x]. They are ignorant of their own heresy. You will commit suicide after completing your righteous mission.
Holy Blessing (Passive) - You are death and bleed immune only once.
Interrogate (Night) - Learn whether target player is a heathen. Does not bypass tailors. - Infinite uses
Ruthless Efficiency (Night) - Guess target’s player exact starting class. Can only guess Blue Dragon Heathen classes from Zealous Pursuit. If incorrect, disable Holy Blessing and Ruthless Efficiency. If correct, provided they are a heathen, kill target player bypassing everything. You cannot be prevented, occupied or redirected. This does not count as a visit. - Infinite uses
Live to see all heathens die.
Heathens cannot be neutrals, unique Blue Dragon or Kings. Both factions will have at least one heathen.
The Inquisitive King (Unofficial Class)
Neutral Special
Pass The Torch (Passive) - If you die, a vote to determine the next king will be held at start of the next day.
Archbishop (Passive) - Your vote counts as two if there are more than 5 players alive except during a Grand Trial. Immune to occupation and redirection. You are immune to death and bleeding once.
Grand Trial (Day) - Instantly put a player on trial for treason lasting up to 24 hours possibly extending day. They may provide a defense within 12 hours, and then the players alive may either vote to execute or pardon. If a majority of players vote to execute, the day will end and the player on trial will be lynched. Otherwise, the day will continue as normal. - 1 use
Guard Shakedown! (Night) - Learn if target player is a heathen. If so they cannot be prevented from dying by any means this night. If not, they will be death immune this night. - Infinite uses
Ruthless Efficiency (Night) - Guess target’s player exact starting class. Can only guess Blue Dragon Heathen classes from Zealous Pursuit. If incorrect, disable your one time death/bleeding immunity and Ruthless Efficiency. If correct, provided they are a heathen, kill target player bypassing everything. You cannot be prevented, occupied or redirected. This does not count as a visit. - Infinite uses
Live to see all heathens die.
Crowned from:
- Inquisitor
Logs are now bound by 1000 characters.
King Elections now last 24 hours.
symbols have been added to clarify which abilities may target King.
Kings now have included that their abilities do not count as visits in their passives.
Summary:
Prince loses execution restriction and Mercy guilt. This makes it less punishing to misexecute and we will see more daring Princes as a result. We also have stronger guaranteed healing, which diminishes healer swing.
Unseen get a major overhaul in losing their traditional promotion cycle and only giving one promotion to starting Assassin. This is a very drastic change, but Unseen was more powerful than Cult and waiting until day 4 to execute an openwolving Mastermind is a strange play that you wouldn’t want to see. This change was not done sooner to leave room for starting “confirmed BD” classes (Priest/Mystic/Hunter/Noble) to still be Mastermind, but with the myriad of changes to confirmability this issue has been mitigated sufficiently to now step over. This also is in line with the design perspective differentiating Cult and Unseen, where the Unseen have a strong base core that has to be kept. The starting Assassin is still very vulnerable to Hunter/Knight/NK kill even if townread, which is the main downside of this change, but for now we adopt this as it also follows ToL.
Cult Leader no longer has to visit their fellow cult in order to make a kill. Prince jailing a second cult already not allowing them to kill is way too much. It also outs too much information to Observer.
Alchemist might have been overtuned to be more difficult as one of the main gripes with the original Alchemist. Not being effective against strongmans just needlessly makes it a lot harder for the Alchemist in Reaper games for instance. We will monitor difficulty of the Alchemist once it actually rolls, dang RNG.
Inquisitor was added as a way of discouraging massclaiming, more neutral variety and following ToL. The claimvig variant as seen in EFoL 3 has been changed up to be guessing exact class to not enter into the murky gray waters of what dictates a claim or not.
Logs have been limited to a limit where fleshed out reads are no longer possible. These belong in the more interactive day environment.
King elections were too short at 12 hours and already led to multiple FoL having half the players unable to vote in time. It still should not be the main focus of a day, so it is ample at 1/3rd daytime.
1 Like
Can you highlight the changes in the class cards maybe?
The summary perfectly explains it but would still be nice to see what exactly got changed.
2 Likes
That would be helpful I dont know if Discourse text can highlight other than changing color though, but that could still work… But the summary does it explain it also
Overall I think all the changes are great, but still confused on what actually changed on Alch
So if he guesses improperly he has to rely on lynches and other night kils,
Does he get it back when he becomes king or nah?
It used to be successfully protecting them, so anything bypassing heals or death immunity and still killing the target wouldn’t count.