King Rework Version 1

[Firekitten]

Guys I think this RHCUBE guy is a disguiser, the normal one WOULD NEVER DO THIS! LYNCH EM

[NuclearBurrito]

@RHCube

How would you change them then?

You know the Kings we have now in ToL?

Take that and go from there making any additional King’s as similar as I can make them.

[NuclearBurrito]

/vote RHCube

Obviously Possessor

[RHCube]

@Firekitten

it’s not useful for a GK to take away someone’s vote

It has other positives which make up for it though. It’s basically a day version of jail, and nobody complains about how Jail occupies their target. And it can be useful, what if there’s a scum you want to silence?

@Firekitten

Also confused is he GK or any king?

What do you mean?

@NuclearBurrito

Also this needs to have a Cooldown

Alright, but I made it like that because kings should be strong.

@NuclearBurrito

Oh also Inquiry is way better than Dark Decree because the second one outs you as EKing where you could have just used decide fate do accomplish the same thing but more consistently and less suspiciously

Alright. And it wouldn’t instantly out them if more Decree abilities were added.

@NuclearBurrito

Also why the fuck would the Fool want to make himself unvotable

That was a mistake, I copied it from the Selfish King.

@NuclearBurrito

And why is this on the fool of all people?

It’s basically a buffed trollbox.

@NuclearBurrito

Same deal here. If you tell the King to Finger someone specific then 9/10 times they can’t because it isn’t their target

What do you mean by this? They would be able to select a target to put on trial.

@NuclearBurrito

Oh and this is just a free win because they have no reason not to play along once you are the last thing stopping the game from ending

I made it like this to give them a chance if all other scum are dead.

@NuclearBurrito

So therefor a King that has Prevented the visit of a living player is confirmed to not have been a SS

Maybe the other Royal Guards could be changed to limited uses?

@NuclearBurrito

Pick one. Both is the equivalent of 3 votes

Which is better?

@NuclearBurrito

Oh. Also this is far too easy to track and far too powerful for a guaranteed and replaceable class to have

Would a limited use version be better?

@NuclearBurrito

There is nothing wrong with it being the less confirmable and more exploitable limited use Night Immunity we have now

It’s a weaker version of other protective abilities. The only advantages it has are against reap and possess, but reaper can use empower reap. Shield is one-use, but can protect against any single attack. Defend is 2 use, but also kills visitors. Plus it’s only 3 uses.

@NuclearBurrito

Or in other words you don’t get to participate in the day also all of your secrets are belong to us.

Isn’t that what jail currently does?

@NuclearBurrito

Oh and don’t forget that I can do it the whole game and everyone has to take my word for it when I say you agreed to it.

Alright, should it have the same limit jail has?

@NuclearBurrito

Also isn’t this entire Passive if you ignore the extra voting part just “I have no counterplay”. What ever happened to “Everything needs counterplay”?

I’ll change it, but it does have counterplay(Shield and Tornado).

@NuclearBurrito

/vote RHCube

Obviously Possessor

Was Fool

[NuclearBurrito]

@RHCube

And it can be useful, what if there’s a scum you want to silence?

If there is a scum you want to silence then you are either also scum or you are doing it wrong by giving them Lynch Immunity

[NuclearBurrito]

@RHCube

It’s a weaker version of other protective abilities.

Except that it can self target, not count as a visit or be occupied and is on a class that auto replaces. All 3 of those things give it a massive advantage over other protectives. Of course those protectives have their own advantages too but that doesn’t make night immunity a bad protection method.

[NuclearBurrito]

@RHCube

but I made it like that because kings should be strong.

Don’t overdo it. You want to make the King as weak as you can afford to. Which usually is slightly better than the class they’re elected from. And also is usually taken care of mostly by the Kings passive effects rather than his abilities

[NuclearBurrito]

@RHCube

Isn’t that what jail currently does?

No. Jail doesn’t prevent communication because that happens over the Day

[NuclearBurrito]

@RHCube

Would a limited use version be better?

No

[NuclearBurrito]

@RHCube

Which is better?

Remove all of them besides the vote for treason being double.

[NuclearBurrito]

@RHCube

I made it like this to give them a chance if all other scum are dead.

Don’t. If you can’t complete your objective in time that’s on you. Especially because causing a misslynch as King is really easy compared to most classes

[NuclearBurrito]

@RHCube

It’s basically a day version of jail, and nobody complains about how Jail occupies their target.

Ability removal isn’t my issue. My issue is that it removes access to the day chat.

[NuclearBurrito]

Remember: WEAKER IS BETTER. You shouldn’t be adding abilities or buffing a class unless it is too weak. Making a class stronger warps the game around that class and thus makes all of the other players insignificant in comparison. And even if you buffed everyone you then have the issue of how the most interesting parts of a game involve exploiting weaknesses and working around limitations, doing that requires weaknesses and limitations to work with or around.

[NuclearBurrito]

So since right now the King DEFINITELY isn’t too weak that means that any King suggestion should be as strong or weaker than the King we have now

[RHCube]

@NuclearBurrito

If there is a scum you want to silence then you are either also scum or you are doing it wrong by giving them Lynch Immunity

But what if there are several scum? And it can be also useful for gathering information, just like jail is multi-purpose.

@NuclearBurrito

self target

Alright, but that’s not enough of a positive.

@NuclearBurrito

not count as a visit or be occupied

Again, that’s useful, but not that huge. Not counting on a visit on a GK is only useful against Circle of Death. For EK it’s the same except it can also bypass observers.

@NuclearBurrito

class that auto replaces

That’s a pro, but you can never be completely sure of the king’s alignment and it only has 3 uses on every king except the starting king.

Actually guard isn’t too bad, but preventing all targeters would still be more useful.

@NuclearBurrito

Jail doesn’t prevent communication because that happens over the Day

But it doesn’t completely prevent communication. They can still speak to and hear the king.

@NuclearBurrito

Ability removal isn’t my issue. My issue is that it removes access to the day chat.

Would it be fine if it was exactly the same yet it didn’t block the day chat?

@NuclearBurrito

So since right now the King DEFINITELY isn’t too weak that means that any King suggestion should be as strong or weaker than the King we have now

Alright, I made an updated version of it, and can you give feedback on it before I post it? I’m still not sure what a mercenary king should look like though, any ideas? Here is the updated version(Note: Azure king is the BD king remaned and Corrupt King is the SS king renamed):

Ancient King

• Crowned From: None(Starting King)

Notes

• The win condition will work like it did before(It will be chosen between a few alternatives which are posted below.

Technical Information for Audience

• They will be sent to a private room(called private chambers) during the day. They will only be able to see the chamber(also prevents them from seeing trials) and its chat.

• The chat will be called “Private Chambers” and can be accessed at any time. The king can speak in both the public chat and the private chambers.

• The king will appear as “King” in the chamber.

• Passive 1: Tenacity- Your actions will not count as visiting. Immune to occupation and redirection. Your vote will count twice. If there is a tie then your vote will determine the outcome. Can speak during the self-defense stage of a trial.

• **Passive 2: Loyalty- ** Immune to death at night once. If you are found guilty of treason then there may not be any trials tomorrow.

• Night Ability 1: Audience(Uses: Unlimited)- Send a guard to summon your target to your private chambers for tomorrow. They may not speak to or hear anyone but you. Disables their day abilities. Prevents them from accusing, voting, and whispering. Issues them a Royal Decree. May not target the same player twice in a row.

• Night Ability 2: Order Execution(Uses: 1)- Send a guard to kill your target. Bypasses death immunity and prevents all positive effects.

• Day Ability 1: Royal Finger(Uses: 2)- Choose a player. They will be immediately put on trial.

• Day Ability 2: Decide Fate(Uses: 1)- Force the court to Execute or Pardon the accused. Pardoning will issue them a Decree for the rest of the day.

Win Condition

• One of the following conditions will be chosen:

• (Chance: 67%) Normal Blue Dragon goal

• (Chance: 33%)Survive to see the Blue Dragon defeated.

Azure King

• Crowned From: Any Blue Dragon

Notes

• I’m not sure the second ability or passive should be.

• Passive 1: Tenacity- Your actions will not count as visiting. Immune to occupation and redirection. Your vote will count twice. If there is a tie then your vote will determine the outcome. Can speak during the self-defense stage of a trial.

• Night Ability 1: Royal Guard(Uses: 3) - Send a guard to prevent all abilities from targeting your target. Tells you who attempts to visit your target.

• Night Ability 2: Loyal Subjects(Uses: 1) - Send a guard to issue a Royal Decree for your target.

• Day Ability 1: Royal Finger(Uses: 2)- Choose a player. They will be immediately put on trial.

• Day Ability 2: Decide Fate(Uses: 1)- Force the court to Execute or Pardon the accused. Pardoning will issue them a Royal Decree for the rest of the day.

• Win Condition: Normal Blue Dragon goal

Master King

• Crowned From: Mastermind or Cult Leader

Notes

• Upon becoming king, the Cult Leader can choose to become a Master King or a Chaotic King

• The Cult Leader will not be replaced if the crowned Cult Leader is still alive. There will only be a new Cult Leader when the crowned one dies

• The Mastermind will not be replaced if the crowned Mastermind is still alive. There will only be a new Mastermind when the crowned one dies

• Passive 1: Tenacity- Your actions will not count as visiting. Immune to occupation and redirection. Your vote will count twice. If there is a tie then your vote will determine the outcome. Can speak during the self-defense stage of a trial.

• Passive 2: Unknown- Immune to death at night once. You will not count towards your faction’s member limit. You may not speak in your faction’s night chat. You will not be notified when a faction member’s class changes or when a new member is converted. Your faction members will still be told who you are

• Night Ability 1: Royal Guard(Uses: 3)- Send a guard to prevent all abilities from targeting your target. Tells you who attempts to visit your target.

• Night Ability 2: Conspiracy(Uses: Unlimited)- Send a guard to convert your target to your faction. 1 night cooldown. Learn your target’s original class.

• Day Ability 1: Royal Finger(Uses: 2)- Choose a player. They will be immediately put on trial.

• Day Ability 2: Decide Fate(Uses: 1)- Force the court to Execute or Pardon the accused. Pardoning will issue them a Decree for the rest of the day.

Win Condition

• Normal faction goal

Chaotic King

• Crowned From: * Crowned From: Assassin or Cult Leader

Notes

• Upon becoming king, the Cult Leader can choose to become a Master King or a Chaotic King

• The Cult Leader will not be replaced if the crowned Cult Leader is still alive. There will only be a new Cult Leader if the crowned one dies.

• If the Assassin becomes king, there will only be a new Assassin if the crowned one dies

• Passive 1: Tenacity- Your actions will not count as visiting. Immune to occupation and redirection. Your vote will count twice. If there is a tie then your vote will determine the outcome. Can speak during the self-defense stage of a trial.

• Passive 2: Unknown- Immune to death at night once. You will not count towards your faction’s member limit. You may not speak in your faction’s night chat. You will not be notified when a faction member’s class changes or when a new member is converted. Your faction members will still be told who you are

• Night Ability 1: Royal Guard(Uses: 3)- Send a guard to prevent all abilities from targeting your target. Tells you who attempts to visit your target.

• Night Ability 2: Executioner(Uses: Unlimited)- Send a guard to kill your target. Bypasses night immunity and prevents positive effects.

• Day Ability 1: Royal Finger(Uses: 2)- Choose a player. They will be immediately put on trial.

• Day Ability 2: Decide Fate(Uses: 1)- Force the court to Execute or Pardon the accused. Pardoning will issue them a Decree for the rest of the day.

Win Condition

• If crowned from Cult: Survive to see the Cult victorious

• If crowned from Unseen: Survive to see the Unseen victorious.

Shadow King

• Crowned From: Any Unseen(except for the Mastermind or Assassin )

• Passive 1: Tenacity- Your actions will not count as visiting. Immune to occupation and redirection. Your vote will count twice. If there is a tie then your vote will determine the outcome. Can speak during the self-defense stage of a trial.

• Passive 2: Unknown- Immune to death at night once. You will not count towards your faction’s member limit. You may not speak in your faction’s night chat. You will not be notified when a faction member’s class changes or when a new member is converted. Your faction members will still be told who you are

• Night Ability 1: Royal Guard(Uses: 3)- Send a guard to prevent all abilities from targeting your target. Tells you who attempts to visit your target.

• Night Ability 2: Dark Decree(Uses: 1)- Send a guard to issue a Royal Decree for your target

• Day Ability 1: Royal Finger(Uses: 2)- Choose a player. They will be immediately put on trial.

• Day Ability 2: Decide Fate(Uses: 1)- Force the court to Execute or Pardon the accused. Pardoning will issue them a Decree for the rest of the day.

• Win Condition: Normal Unseen goal

Crimson King

• Crowned From: Any Cult(except for the Cult Leader)

• Passive 1: Tenacity- Your actions will not count as visiting. Immune to occupation and redirection. Your vote will count twice. If there is a tie then your vote will determine the outcome. Can speak during the self-defense stage of a trial.

• Passive 2: Unknown- Immune to death at night once. You will not count towards your faction’s member limit. You may not speak in your faction’s night chat. You will not be notified when a faction member’s class changes or when a new member is converted. Your faction members will still be told who you are

• Night Ability 1: Royal Guard(Uses: 3)- Send a guard to prevent all abilities from targeting your target. Tells you who attempts to visit your target.

• Night Ability 2: Crimson Decree(Uses: 1)- Send a guard to issue a Royal Decree for your target

• Day Ability 1: Royal Finger(Uses: 2)- Choose a player. They will be immediately put on trial.

• Day Ability 2: Decide Fate(Uses: 1)- Force the court to Execute or Pardon the accused. Pardoning will issue them a Decree for the rest of the day.

• Win Condition: Survive to see the Cult victorious

Selfish King

• Crowned From: Alchemist and Pretender

Notes

• Fool’s hide should be replaced with this hide. This wouldn’t be as confirmable since there are more prevention abilities.

• Passive 1: Tenacity- Your actions will not count as visiting. Immune to occupation and redirection. Your vote will count twice. If there is a tie then your vote will determine the outcome. Can speak during the self-defense stage of a trial.

• Passive 2: Cowardly- Immune to death at night once. If you are found guilty of treason then there may not be any further king elections.

• Night Ability 1: Hide(Uses: 3)- Prevent all abilities from targeting you tonight. Tells you everyone who attempts to visit you.

• Night Ability 2: Meditate(Uses: 1)- Issue a Royal Decree for yourself.

• Day Ability 1: Royal Finger(Uses: 2)- Choose a player. They will be immediately put on trial.

• Day Ability 2: Decide Fate(Uses: 1)- Force the court to Execute or Pardon the accused. Pardoning will issue them a Decree for the rest of the day.

• Win Condition: Survive

Corrupt King

• Crowned From: Sellsword(If any other neutral class gets the SS goal then it should also become this king)

• Passive 1: Tenacity- Your actions will not count as visiting. Immune to occupation and redirection. Your vote will count twice. If there is a tie then your vote will determine the outcome. Can speak during the self-defense stage of a trial.

• Passive 2: Guards!- Immune to death at night once.

• Night Ability 1: Shadow Guard(Uses: 2)- Send a guard to prevent all abilities from targeting your target tonight. Kills everyone attempting to visit them.

• Night Ability 2: Inquiry(Uses: Unlimited) - Send a guard to learn your target’s exact class. Determine if they are a heathen.

• Day Ability 1: Royal Finger(Uses: 2)- Choose a player. They will be immediately put on trial.

• Day Ability 2: Decide Fate(Uses: 1)- Force the court to Execute or Pardon the accused. Pardoning will issue them a Decree for the rest of the day.

• Win Condition: Survive to see the Blue Dragon’s defeat.

Vengeful King

• Crowned From: Inquisitor

Notes

• To choose a class for Contraband, a list will pop up that is the same as Defile’s.

• For contraband, it says “Until you change targets” and still has 1 use. This is in case any ability which restores uses ever gets added.

• Passive 1: Tenacity- Your actions will not count as visiting. Immune to occupation and redirection. Your vote will count twice. If there is a tie then your vote will determine the outcome. Can speak during the self-defense stage of a trial.

• Passive 2: Guards!- Immune to death at night once.

• Night Ability 1: Inquiry(Uses: Unlimited) - Send a guard to learn your target’s exact class. Determine if they are a heathen.

• Night Ability 2: Contraband(Uses: 1) - Choose a class. Send a guard to make your target appear as chosen class upon death. Lasts until you change targets

• Day Ability 1: Royal Finger(Uses: 2)- Choose a player. They will be immediately put on trial.

• Day Ability 2: Decide Fate(Uses: 1)- Force the court to Execute or Pardon the accused. Pardoning will issue them a Decree for the rest of the day.

• Win Condition: Survive to see all heathens dead.

Depressed King

• Crowned from: Fool & Scorned

Notes

• Fool’s hide should be changed to this version. This wouldn’t be as confirmable since there are more prevention abilities.

• Possessor’s Mind Control should be changed to this version.

• Destiny can not target yourself(that would be overpowered)

• Passive 1: Tenacity- Your actions will not count as visiting. Immune to occupation and redirection. Your vote will count twice. If there is a tie then your vote will determine the outcome. Can speak during the self-defense stage of a trial.

• Passive 2: Retribution- If you are found guilty of treason then you will kill your accuser.

• Night Ability 1: Hide(Uses: 3)- Prevent all abilities from targeting you tonight.

• **Day Ability 1: Mind Control(Uses: 1)-Blackmail your target for the rest of the day. Anything you say or whisper will appear as if they said it instead of you. You will control their accusing and vote for the rest of the day. Receive the contents of all(public and private) whispers sent to your target.

• **Day Ability 2: Destiny(Uses:1)-**During a trial, force the court to execute or pardon the accused. Pardoning issues them a Decree for the rest of the day. Otherwise, immediately put your target on trial.

• Win Condition: Convince the court that you are guilty of treason, and force them to execute you

[NuclearBurrito]

@RHCube

Would it be fine if it was exactly the same yet it didn’t block the day chat?

“Whispers between you and player will not be shown to the public and cannot be spied on”

Done

[NuclearBurrito]

@RHCube

Your vote will count twice. If there is a tie then your vote will determine the outcome.

@RHCube

If you are found guilty of treason then there may not be any trials tomorrow.

You didn’t solve either of these issues

[NuclearBurrito]

@RHCube

• (Chance: 33%)Survive to see the Blue Dragon defeated.

A starting evil King is not going to survive.

Sellsword Goal or Unseen/Cult Goal.

[NuclearBurrito]

@RHCube

Bypasses night immunity and prevents positive effects.

On a replaceable occupy immune bonus Unseen/Cult super voter with a free fake claim? No

[NuclearBurrito]

@RHCube

• If crowned from Cult: Survive to see the Cult victorious
• If crowned from Unseen: Survive to see the Unseen victorious.

Still listed as survive