King Rework Version 1

Feedback/Suggestions
#62

Current Hide is still actually better than this hide because night immunity is suspicious.

#63

For fool anyways

#64

Hide AND oneshot immunity on a survivor? You may as well just say “You win”

#65

Wat

#66

Still makes Guards confirm the King as non-sellsword

#67

Same issue as sellsword (and also the reason why we use night immunity instead of prevention among other things)

#68

And none of this justifies buffing the Kings in the first place. The only thing that makes sense is changing the MM’s King to have convert and making Neut kings keep their wincondition (and even then the ability’s should be as close as they can be to BD King)

#69

Which is exactly the issue. Prevention guards are TOO useful

#70

Here is more what I would do for starting King for example:

Note: Kings in general can speak on the self defense stage. You don’t need to specify

Starting Good King

Passive 1: Tenacity - You are occupy and redirect immune. Your actions do not count as visiting
Passive 2: Loyalty - If you are lynched then there will be no trial tomorrow

Day Ability 1: Royal Finger - Put target player on the stand immediately
Day Ability 2: Decide Fate - Instantly execute or pardon a player on trial. If you pardon them then they cannot be voted up for the rest of the day

Night Ability 1: Guards! - Give target player death immunity tonight. You can self target (5 uses)
Night Ability 2: Audience! - Whispers between you and target player will be hidden from the public tomorrow and cannot be intercepted (4 uses)

Starting Evil King

Passive 1: Tenacity - You are occupy and redirect immune. Your actions do not count as visiting
Passive 2: Scheming - You are immune to death once

Day Ability 1: Royal Finger - Put target player on the stand immediately
Day Ability 2: Decide Fate - Instantly execute or pardon a player on trial. If you pardon them then they cannot be voted up for the rest of the day

Night Ability 1: Allies! - Learn if target player’s class if they are not Blue Dragon (3 uses)
Night Ability 2: Audience! - Whispers between you and target player will be hidden from the public tomorrow and cannot be intercepted. (4 uses)
Goal: The Blue Dragon loses or Unseen/Cult Wincon

Literally just replace the Day ability’s and nothing else for elected Kings and have Mastermind Keep convert if he is elected (just convert. Nothing else)

if we give neutrals their own Kings then you don’t actually need to change anything for most of them. Literally just have them keep their wincon and let Neutral King’s kit do the rest. (Besides Merc who can instead just have unlimited guards but with a cooldown and 2 brilders per block and Inquisitor who needs a heathen check)

If you REALLY want them to have a difference then let any elected neutral keep their primary ability. Whatever it is. But then make neutral king only have 2 guards to compensate

#71

That’s fine, but I would still prefer it if my version was added. I made it so they could talk to the king to prevent it from being boring.

What’s wrong with the first one?

Alright, I’ll change it.

Would just bypassing immunity and preventing healing be fine? It’s weak if it doesn’t bypass healing.

Forgot to change that.

Maybe the “Target is immune” message could be merged with the prevention method to make up for this.

Alright I’ll remove the one-time immunity.

Lol I copied that from vengeful king. My mistake.

Then what other ability would fit SS? Or should it just be the same?

What issue?

Night immunity is weak though.

And night immunity is a bit weak.

I’d like to give the starting kings something unique. Not sure what it should be for starting BD king though.

#72

Night immunity is perfectly fine

1 Like
#73

GOOD. That is a GOOD thing because it means that the King is less swingy

#74

Which is why it is a good thing I incorporated a version of your second suggestion into my post

#75

Still would be an overall nerf inspite of the stretch cases.

#76

OP even before taking into account the day ability’s. The King should be a tie breaker. Meaning that if there are 2 people and one of them is a King then the King has control. If there is a 2v2 then the King has control. However in a 2v1 the King should always lose

#77

Baring the King turning the 2 against each other of course.

#78

Remember. Something being more useful is not justification for it being a better ability for the game. You need to first demonstrate that a buff is needed at all before you can say we should add any given buff. And if buffing the class is NOT the intention then you need to also nerf it by an equal or greater amount

1 Like
#79

“Simplified”

Still too much fighting the formatting to read tbh

#80

I made a new thread with a few nerfs/reworks and added some of your changes.

@orangeandblack5 I also simplified it even more