Orangevitational - Aliens Win!

[Eavesdropper]

All right, I appreciate the effort.

[Surveillance]

@Eavesdropper

what did you think of my takes on these two slots?

they are correct but idk if the things you’re pointing out make the slot mafia.
i’m just. shrugging.

[Eavesdropper]

Ok, so do you have Officer and Scientist around roughly the same tier in your reads?

[Eavesdropper]

I mean roughly the same tier as each other, not same tier as I do.

[Surveillance]

yeah.
updating my last list officer’s realistically at the same level as my other poe characters.

[Surveillance]

i’m not interested in solving them right now mostly because i want to kill facilitator and go from there, and officer voting facilitator instinctively made me give him townpoints i think.

[Eavesdropper]

Ok, makes enough sense I guess.
I have a couple more slots I want to ISO, but I gotta go for a bit so I’ll likely do the ISOing when I come back if day hasn’t ended by then, else it’s just a quick overnight task.

[Eavesdropper]

@Surveillance

officer voting facilitator instinctively made me give him townpoints i think

Ah, I see the problem. It did the opposite for me, actually, which is why my vote’s on Officer. I mean, sure, I went and scumcased Facilitator too, but at least Facilitator responded to my scumcase on them. Officer has yet to come in and respond to me, but I kind of think they’ve been looking for easy pushes and if Facilitator is town, they definitely fit the bill. If Facilitator flips scum then I can probably drop this take and look more into what specifically Officer had to say about Facilitator.

[Surveillance]

the problem with flip-dependent reads is that we have to trust the coroner.
and yes, i do think their slot is town, but how do you work with that?

[Scientist]

I’m gonna start with Facilitato - they seem the most contested and I had some towny pings from them reading up, which is weiiird considering they’re top wagon.

@Facilitator

if you’re feeling spicy you can jail officer

they have no night actions so it’s always gonna be good imo

I think this is towny line of thought tbh
I guess it’s easy for wolves to hop into the thread on mechanics but it feels towny to think about “Oh, Officer has no night actions and would be a good jailtarget”

@Facilitator

shouldn’t be that hard then

Summary

i like the sass in this post

dont
take this seriously

I don’t really like how Facilitator keeps falling back to mech instead of making Reads TM

@Facilitator

a bit leave me alone freezergeezer

jiuhisrgesurhuwh

@Facilitator

Memes aside, this is absurdly scummy because the information about the NKs is after who your fellow wolves are in the alignment card, so in order to have even read the NK stuff switcheroni would have had to read about the other wolves.

I feel like this is towny even thought its wrongly placed suspicion (the wincons are in the OP)

The attention to this detail is super towny, tbh

@Facilitator

Oh.

I feel extremely dumb and will quietly hide in a corner now.

/unvote

Everyone calling this a townslip is dead wrong, though (that was a scumslip if anything), but the fact that everyone else thought it was a townslip at the time and teleportato didn’t run with it makes me like the slot.

Still gonna vote for self-prez if necessary, though.

and then the apology after also feelds really towny

i kidna don’t want to lynch them just after these two posts

@Facilitator

Scumish
Security
Eavesdropper

@Facilitator what made you decide Secuiry was scummy

Facilitator has repeated jailing officer like, 4-5 times? That’s probably towny? Or just doesn’t make them w/w

@Facilitator

Wait people are here sleep can wait a little bit longer

I kinda like how they waited to go to sleep to talk to people

@Facilitator

The benefit isn’t just to stop the no, though - it’s also to protect the officer. This is always good because you either stop kp (which would be amazing but we know that probably won’t happen) or if you don’t stop kp you protect town officer, which is also always good.

Number 6

@Facilitator

I feel like town coroner just cares a lot more. They have arguably one of the most powerful roles in the game and I think they’d want to be more involved.

Good Thought
(idk how to elaborate on this I just think this is towny)

TLDR:

I’m really unsure why Facilitator is being voted rn? I think their iso is at least above null, if not pretty town

Could someone link me to the case on them?

[Scientist]

uhh

gonna go with comms next I remember bad vibes

[Scientist]

@Scientist

I’m really unsure why Facilitator is being voted rn? I think their iso is at least above null, if not pretty town

Could someone link me to the case on them?

signal boost

[Scientist]

My iso tab just disappeared

:UUUUUUUUU

[Eavesdropper]

I think I gave a partial case on them and then retracted it, so I’m not sure I’d be of much help here.

[Scientist]

Communications iso is just
eh

I wish they could elaborate more on some of their reads, I see a lot of different pokes and prods but I don’t really feel like they follow through, their line of thought seems kind of disconnected if that makes sense

Like, for example they call out Cryo for being tonally inconsistient, but they don’t follow through and explain why that’s wolfy to them, and when they pop in later they don’t revisit the read

@Communications

officer probably town

why

@Communications

i’d say officer over student but this is a fine core

why

@Communications

your read on trapsetter isn’t thoroughly explained for how strong it is and your reads on me, student, and scientist (the latter in the context of your surveillance read) feel like you came up with the read before actually thinking about the reasoning

This is a good post - I still want reasoning on their tonal read though

@Communications

this is a wolfy distinction and i would go so far as to say it makes this slot likely lost wolf

Probably a good catch? why are they lost wolf hunting

@Communications

this is probably town

why

@Communications

/vote teleporter

can talk about eaves after i wake up if anyone wants to discuss that slot with me

i’m headed off

I guess the follow through with their earlier sus on Teleporter could be towny?

But they just cased Eaves, so why not vote them
What about Cryo?

Meh

idk where I’d place them right now maybe I should ISO them again

[Luxy]

VOTECOUNT

Player	Voted by	Votes
Facilitator	Officer, Cryogenics, Surveillance	4/7
Teleporter	Scientist, Communications	2/7
Officer	Teleporter, Eavesdropper	2/7
Scientist	Trapsetter	1/7
Not Voting	Security, Student, Coroner, Facilitator	4

With 12 players alive, it takes 7 to reach majority.

[Eavesdropper]

@Eavesdropper

@Facilitator

Currently my thoughts are:

Town
Trapper
Cryo
Surveillance

Townish
Teleporter
Student

Null
Comms
Officer
Scientist

Scumish
Security
Eavesdropper

Scum
Coroner

Ok I read Facilitator’s ISO of a whopping 29 posts and see his readlist
Pretty sure he hadn’t even read up to the point where I entered the thread, and Coroner didn’t even pop in until after I did, so where the heck are these reads coming from if not just fabricated?

Weird, bro.

@Eavesdropper

Also they 180’d on Teleporter but not in the most natural way.
They thought that they caught Teleporter scumslipping until they read the clarification and removed their vote, but never explicitly said that they townread Tele for the clarification. And yet they’ve placed Tele in their “townish” tier.

@Eavesdropper

@Facilitator

Scumish

Security

And here’s another thing.
I may be a hypocrite for saying this and also having Security in my outer PoE, but I also think that it’s a very easy slot to jump on because there’s literally nothing towny from them. I feel like if too many people have Security in their scumleans then it counterindicates that Security is probably town, but maybe it’s stupid to read the trends this early, especially before Security takes their shot.

@Eavesdropper

Bottom line is that I think Facilitator’s readlist is yuck because I think there’s scum in their null tier and not necessarily in their scumreads (I know I’m not scum, and I have no clue about Coroner because they’re basically playing dead fwiw, but I don’t think Facilitator should have put both of us as scum if they didn’t actually read that far into the game where we entered the thread).

@Eavesdropper

If I use the same logic as I just did with Security, maybe Facilitator is LHF instead of a wolf because of all the players piling onto them. But I just have huge issues with their readlist and it’s not just an OMGUS, they literally did not mention a read on my slot or Coroner’s even once before putting us both as scum, and the only time I saw Facilitator mention my name before that was saying they hadn’t reached the point in the thread where I’d entered yet.

Nagl.

This was my case on Facilitator, but then I rethought my read and really, the end result readlist there that I quoted was singlehandedly what I thought looked the worst in their ISO to be completely honest.

And their response to me was actually pretty decent?

@Facilitator

@Eavesdropper

Pretty sure he hadn’t even read up to the point where I entered the thread, and Coroner didn’t even pop in until after I did, so where the heck are these reads coming from if not just fabricated?

I did get to your posts, just didn’t have time to write about them.

Which is an extremely flimsy excuse, but the truth.

@Eavesdropper

but never explicitly said that they townread Tele for the clarification.

@Facilitator

but the fact that everyone else thought it was a townslip at the time and teleportato didn’t run with it makes me like the slot.

It wasnt a townread explicitly, but I thought it was pretty clear that I liked telephone’s slot.

@Eavesdropper

And here’s another thing.

I may be a hypocrite for saying this and also having Security in my outer PoE, but I also think that it’s a very easy slot to jump on because there’s literally nothing towny from them.

That… what?

How are you sus of me thinking one of the most anti-town slot in the game is scum?

@Eavesdropper

they literally did not mention a read on my slot or Coroner’s even once before putting us both as scum

To be fair, yours were mostly based on gut and I put you only in scumish, not scum.

I mean this didn’t look too bad

@Eavesdropper

I came back here because I suddenly got cold feet on offering to vote Facilililililitator

@Eavesdropper

I realized there were a couple things pointing in their favor and now I’m trying to reevaluate, give me a bit of time.

This is where I came back and started trying to rework the slot already.

@Facilitator

@Surveillance

i think talking about who we should jail is outright bad, because there’s no way we’re going to nail scum kp like this. wolves will manipulate us into not selecting scum kp, and we won’t block the nightkill, ever.

The benefit isn’t just to stop the no, though - it’s also to protect the officer. This is always good because you either stop kp (which would be amazing but we know that probably won’t happen) or if you don’t stop kp you protect town officer, which is also always good.

@Surveillance

something that came later, and i think only i called it.

This?

@Surveillance

is this another player’s townslip? i had the same thought when thinking about the setup pregame, but you actually do know the identity of your partner. re-read the OP.

If so, I still don’t think that’s a town slip because porter’s claimed lack of op knowledge would be at odds with their previous posts.

[quote=“Eavesdropper, post:697, topic:88422, full:true”]

[quote=“Facilitator, post:682, topic:88422”]

@Facilitator

nobody jails officer cuz they want to jail sus ppl lol

but fr tho rbing someone with no night actions helps town because the only thing they can do at night is kill
[/quote]

To clarify this: my reasoning was that you’d probably jail a top town for protection or top scum for role blocking. Officer was not either of those at that point, hence the hot take.

Mechanically speaking, I think it’s good to jail officer since village officer is protected (and rbed, which doesnt matter) and scum officer is rbed (and protected, which doesnt matter). Either way is a win win.

@Cryogenics

This reasoning makes perfect sense, but it was mostly the wording in your original post that I didn’t like. You didn’t give any sort of hint that you considered that Officer could be a wolf being jailed, since you said “they want to jail sus ppl” which made it look like you were already saying that Officer wasn’t sus (and hence your saying that Officer was neither top town nor top scum is a bit odd in conjunction with the “sus” wording you had before).

[quote=“Facilitator, post:683, topic:88422”]

@Eavesdropper

Pretty sure he hadn’t even read up to the point where I entered the thread, and Coroner didn’t even pop in until after I did, so where the heck are these reads coming from if not just fabricated?
[/quote]

I did get to your posts, just didn’t have time to write about them.

Which is an extremely flimsy excuse, but the truth.

Is it bad that I actually think the excuse is so flimsy that a wolf could do better? idk

@Facilitator

It wasnt a townread explicitly, but I thought it was pretty clear that I liked telephone’s slot.

Well, it is now lol.

[quote=“Facilitator, post:683, topic:88422”]

@Eavesdropper

And here’s another thing.

I may be a hypocrite for saying this and also having Security in my outer PoE, but I also think that it’s a very easy slot to jump on because there’s literally nothing towny from them.
[/quote]

That… what?

How are you sus of me thinking one of the most anti-town slot in the game is scum?

Because iirc, at the beginning of the game, a ton of people jumped on Student right away until they posted enough to skyrocket up the consensus readlist. I was just extremely worried the same thing was going to happen with Security. I search for patterns in the thread because they often occur in forum mafia games, and it’s much easier to prevent the same mistake from happening when you know what to look out for.

That being said, I’ll still wait for Security to make however horrible of a shot they’re going to make, and judge them for it afterwards.

@Facilitator

@Eavesdropper

they literally did not mention a read on my slot or Coroner’s even once before putting us both as scum
[/quote]

To be fair, yours were mostly based on gut and I put you only in scumish, not scum.

Ok, I guess “gut” is an ok-ish explanation (not that I like it, but it’s an explanation at the very least) but Coroner only made two completely NAI posts so I’m not sure why you have them as your top scumread already when literally everyone else has given more content and is at least somewhat more readable.

[quote=“Eavesdropper, post:698, topic:88422, full:true”]

@Facilitator

@Surveillance

i think talking about who we should jail is outright bad, because there’s no way we’re going to nail scum kp like this. wolves will manipulate us into not selecting scum kp, and we won’t block the nightkill, ever.
[/quote]

The benefit isn’t just to stop the no, though - it’s also to protect the officer. This is always good because you either stop kp (which would be amazing but we know that probably won’t happen) or if you don’t stop kp you protect town officer, which is also always good.

If Officer is a wolf then honestly this holds no water.

@Facilitator

@Eavesdropper

This reasoning makes perfect sense, but it was mostly the wording in your original post that I didn’t like. You didn’t give any sort of hint that you considered that Officer could be a wolf being jailed, since you said “they want to jail sus ppl” which made it look like you were already saying that Officer wasn’t sus (and hence your saying that Officer was neither top town nor top scum is a bit odd in conjunction with the “sus” wording you had before).

That’s a very fair point.

I’ll be real here - my wording is terrible for all of the posts before I switched back to my normal playstyle/typing habits. Any suspicion because of that is probably deserved on my end.

@Eavesdropper

Is it bad that I actually think the excuse is so flimsy that a wolf could do better? idk

Eh

I could do the flimsy excuse thing as scum any day

This back and forth with Facilitator seemed less wolfy than I expected. I don’t really know if it’s towny per se, but it was not like I read the posts and thought “omg this slot is lockscum YEET” after reading it.

[Scientist]

(not order in tiers)

Facilitator
Security
Trapsetter

Student

Coroner
Officer
Comms

left:
Cryo
Teleporter
Surv
Eaves

[Scientist]

I’ll be back in like 15 mins

[Eavesdropper]

RIP, the quotes broke.