[SFM] Newbie-Friendly Pokèmon 9er - Town Win

[WindwardAway]

@kiromishiro21

Sure … and they leave me unprotected

Honestly, yes because:

1. you’re the third PR claim in a game with only 7 townies
2. the bodyguard has twice as high of a chance of dying (either he’s attacked or his target is attacked) so having the doctor on the bodyguard can prove the doctor

[kiromishiro21]

That does make more sense. Now I understand you a little better

[WindwardAway]

If I die tonight, you’re guaranteed that Cloned did not guard me. If Cloned dies tonight, we know for a fact that you didn’t heal Cloned. That’s why the setup is the way it is; if Cloned were the doctor and you were the guard, I would have reversed it so that the guard was still in the middle.

[kiromishiro21]

Likewise … Cloned is my biggest scum now. And I think there is one among the others

[WindwardAway]

@kiromishiro21

And I think there is one among the others

Any thoughts currently about the others? Is there anyone in particular you think is really scummy?

[kiromishiro21]

So under that logic … For me cloned is mafia so I want to vote for him but I will let this be resolved tomorrow through the actions we take. Now there must be 1 or 2 mafia among the others

[YoubutWorse]

@WindwardAway

This was in reference to Worse. I’m still extremely sus of Worse. He jumped from voting me right after I taunted and asked people why they aren’t just voting me immediately, to voting Silviu when Cloned outed as PR.

Well I thought, at the time, that you were good. I thought you had to be either scum or a power role, and I more thought you were scum. Why wouldnt I vote you?

@WindwardAway

They were late to jump on the wagon and they would’ve gotten a town PR voted out pretty smoothly if they could just convince one more person that I was the best candidate for lynching, but the easy work was being done by the actual town, so Cloned and Worse didn’t even have to say much

Every reason i had sus on you was already pointed out by other people. Plus I felt it was weird that Min was sticking up for you so I thought it was w/w. This is another one of the reasons I think you’re town

[kiromishiro21]

I keep thinking of worse because he blames me and in gorta. Because I didn’t like it when he change your vote so fast

[YoubutWorse]

@YoubutWorse

was sticking up for you so I thought it was w/w. This is another one of the reasons I think you’re town

since min was proven to be town and he stuck up for you*

[WindwardAway]

@YoubutWorse

he

*they

@YoubutWorse

since min was proven to be town

Before Min died, most of us had a more or less nullread on them. I saw people saying both townlean and scumlean. This is the strongest reason why I think Min had a more or less correct readlist - they were kind of sus even to the rest of the town, but they got kill targeted even though the scum could have easily tried to push them instead.

[kiromishiro21]

If it really is artic I would be very surprised and … gg.
I think artic has a good brain because he did the numbers before everyone else. This will be disastrous if we don’t kill a scum

[YoubutWorse]

@WindwardAway

Before Min died, most of us had a more or less nullread on them. I saw people saying both townlean and scumlean. This is the strongest reason why I think Min had a more or less correct readlist - they were kind of sus even to the rest of the tow

Yeah, I agree with this but I am town. I still dont know why scum would rather kill min then a town inves who could potentially out them

[kiromishiro21]

How noob are you? How many games do you have here?

[YoubutWorse]

This is my first game ever

[kiromishiro21]

loooooooooollllllllllllll welcome :3

[WindwardAway]

@YoubutWorse

I still dont know why scum would rather kill min then a town inves who could potentially out them

Because there were two outed PRs and it was likely the second one was a protective. If they figured it was a bodyguard they could’ve tried to kill anyway to get him out, but if it were a doctor they’d get no night kills.

[kiromishiro21]

Gorta … I see that you are writing … If you want to say something it is time

[an_gorta_pratai]

@Appelsiini

This is where Gorta is wrong. I’m capable of faking my tone and pushing agenta, but it’s incredibly difficult for me to control the thread as either alignment. I’m the type of wolf who hides behind their towniness, offers opinions here and there but does not lead – the only exception is when I’m trying to save my teammates, which is fairly typical for me.

I recall you being able to control the thread. I want to look at 3 scum games of yours and 3 town games and then make a decision for myself.

@Appelsiini

And this is your mistake. The fact that you completely stopped questioning him at all even when he has not self-resolved, or even CONSIDERING a world where he is a wolf anymore, is a clear indication that you have TMI on this matter. In a world where you are a wolf and he is a villager, you’d know it’s pointless to push him so now you’re sheeping him instead and trying to blame your vote on that.

I have questioned him several times, even saying we should solve in the two of them. I have came to the conclusions from what happened last night that Cloned is very likely legit.

@Appelsiini

f you really had a townread on Silviu, why didn’t you discuss it with him? Why didn’t you try to CFD to someone else? Why did you mindlessly follow someone on a person you were supposedly confident would flip town? Because you didn’t care about who it was that got killed, that’s why. Pushing a cuddle on a PR would’ve looked absolutely awful for you, and that’s why you gave up so quickly and bought his claim immediately – that’s what I believe.

We had 5-10 minutes left and I don’t know if they would have went for anyone else. I bought his claim because I don’t think he was bsing. Cloned knows better than that. Why would I want to kill someone I thoght was claiming pr?

@Appelsiini

Also, I wouldn’t advocate to rely on a meta read when it comes to Kiro. We don’t know what they act like as a wolf, so saying “this clears them because they also act like this as town” holds no ground. Who’s to say their meta isn’t similar as both alignments?

My reasoning is that, like with people like Silviu and Min, it’s hard for newbies to replicate their town meta. Some can and some can’t, hell even some of the people with experience can’t replicate their town meta’s. Why would we expect someone like Kiro of being able to replicate their townplay?

@Appelsiini

Gorta immediately hopping on to this train of thought seems an awful lot like pushing agenta. He has been talking to Cloned like he knows he’s town ever since he claimed PR, it sort of feels like he’s saying “Cloned might be still scum” just for the sake of courtesy, but doesn’t really believe that. He’s saying it like they’re just words, not holding any meaning behind them.

The key word is “likely”, but what wind said makes sense, hence why I dropped it. They could only ever be scum together. I suppose we could explore that world more, but I think wind has the right idea. I was going to suggest that Cloned protects Wind and wind tracks Kiro.

@Appelsiini

without taking a single moment to consider the possibility of both of them being scum.

I think you are being dishonest with us. I have indeed considered that they could be town and I can quote it.

@Appelsiini

and he should be, given that town will lose if they both end up being town.

What part of “we don’t blindly lynch between them” don’t you understand?

@Appelsiini

What will you do if they flip town, are you going to cuddle the other one as well? What are your reads at all?

again, I said I wanted to solve it, but I never called for their heads. I worked through this thing and came to the conclusion that they can’t both be individual scum.

@YoubutWorse

I think its possible, they haven’t been pushing eachother that much and I don’t trust either of them. I think it’s also possible that Gorta may have made a misplay, but I feel confident on my scumread with Kiro. Those 2 are the people I’m most willing to vote rn, but that will probably change overtime

I said I would expand what I think about Kiro today.

[WindwardAway]

@an_gorta_pratai

They could only ever be scum together.

@an_gorta_pratai

I worked through this thing and came to the conclusion that they can’t both be individual scum.

Why do you think either Cloned and I are both scum, or neither of us is scum? Is there a particular reason we couldn’t be town/wolf? I know I speculated on how that would or wouldn’t work, but I’d like to hear your thoughts as well.

[an_gorta_pratai]

@an_gorta_pratai

or if y’all are both town the other pr gets accused the next day

@an_gorta_pratai

In the world of Cloned being scum PR the other scum could carry out the kill and cloned visits wind to verify his role and do the thing, but I don’t know why Cloned wouldn’t push Wind in this scenario.

@Appelsiini see here

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@an_gorta_pratai

I’m starting to think that Kiro might be evil here. Like you said, they kept pushing Cloned even after I stopped thinking there was a wolf between you/cloned. The biggest thing is that Cloned’s claim has more validity to me at this moment and I doubt we have 2 healing roles. unless we suck that bad

@YoubutWorse I said this last night before I went to bed