[VFM] JoaT^2 - (6/15) - 😹 Pirates (Town) Win!

[Wisp]

you are the one who has meta on him
I skimmed those town/mafia games that peeps gave me and saw very little difference

@CallMeIo

Alignment is simply “how”

god I dislike u…

good night

[CallMeIo]

I’m sorry to hear that.

[CallMeIo]

Maybe you can change your mind when you fully comprehend what I’m talking about.

[CallMeIo]

Elephas give me that wall post you’ve been typing up there.

[Wazza]

@Wisp

god I dislike u…

you seem to dislike everyone who disagrees with you ;/

[Wisp]

no I don’t lol

[Wazza]

You did it with my yesterday.
You’re doing it with Io today.

Yes you do.

[Wisp]

well that isnt everybody, is it?

[CallMeIo]

No need to be so hostile.
We are friends who share the same alignment!

[Elephas]

Alright here’s the deal.
CallMeIo is very likely just a wolf, but we never lynch them today.

If they aren’t a wolf, they will die. If they are a wolf, they will be outted come LYLO (or possibly before).

The entire push on me is in bad faith and I have yet to see a single solid argument as to why I am a wolf. I originally thought it was TWTBAW but they have been pre-flipping me for almost thirty-six hours. If it were a reaction-test, I would expect it to be outted by now. If they were a villager, I would expect them to be open to re-evaluation.

@Flameo

• Why did you target Elephas?
• Why did you decide to reveal in this manner?
• Why did you choose motion detection over another JOAT ability.
• Why couldn’t Elephas be other JOAT or visited by other JOAT?

They have yet to answer any of these questions.

---

This post is from today:

@CallMeIo

Flameo might be Elephas’s Buddy.
Making the Last one Between Mole, Suilt and Wazza.

^ Note that there is no mention of CatLover here. Also, Sulit is here, yet they said this yesterday:

@CallMeIo

Like I want the Town Core to be Vulgard, Leafia, Wisp, Sulit and Myself.

Why did they randomly start scumreading sulit?
They also said that katze was likely killed by sulit. Quite literally out of nowhere. The last time they mentioned sulit was to say they wanted her in their towncore.

@CallMeIo

Kat was either killed by Suilt or killed by a team that was all town on Kat’s list. (Most likely option)
If you kill a player who isn’t a main priority kill and also Town reads your entire team it will allow you to go into Day 2 trying to say the NK was probably due to Katze finding someone scum. And they will probably try and use Katze’s TR on them as an excuse to not eliminate them.
This will allow scum to setup multiple mislynches.

---

@Wisp

I like how when I was all over wanting to lynch Ele yesterday, nobody wanted to touch that
Now they are obvious scum?

@CallMeIo

Oh I did.
But Mole had more attraction so I voted that instead.

@CallMeIo

They are both my scum reads.

@CallMeIo

Mole is Probably Elephas partner so I don’t mind this yeet.

@CallMeIo

Yeah I’m more inclined that this is the partner over Mole.

@CallMeIo

Yeah.
Flameo more likely.

@CallMeIo

/Vote Flameo

I want to change Vote from Mole to This

@CallMeIo

I’m more confident on this being Elephas partner.

@CallMeIo

If I had to guess right now.
I’d say CatLover, Elephas and Flameo is the Team.

They have zero progression on CatLover. They go from scumreading Mole to replacing him with CatLover as my “possible partner” at the flip of a switch. Why are they not voting Mole if they have scumread Mole for longer than CatLover or Flameo? The logic makes no sense. They are quite literally all over the place.

@CallMeIo

And what exactly is Mole’s Flip going to accomplish if they flip Town?

So let me ask you this Wisp.
If Mole was a different alignment then he is this game and he acts the same way he is in this game would he still be scum because of his Playstyle?
Because that isn’t how you win at FM.

@CallMeIo

I as well do feel Mole could be scum.
But I also don’t trust it that scum didn’t plan on this as one of there escape options to a good ol mislynch.

---

Oh, and here are some posts from d1. Look at the lack of progression:

@CallMeIo

So you are for the ash wagon but don’t vote that?
You don’t even acknowledge my reasoning and let it off us non existence and you think someone flipping scum forces me to defend myself simply because I was wrong about them? Ok.
Seems to me like you just desperately wanted me to changed my mind about Ash.
Won’t happen.
My vote today is on Mole or You.

@CallMeIo

Yes. Exactly.
Because I think your Mole’s Partner.
I plan to keep my vote on Mole but if people vote you and you become Top Wagon I’ll vote you and I’m not going to deny that.

^ These are to Wazza. If Io scumread Wazza and Mole so much… why didn’t they “target” one of them with the JOAT ability? It doesn’t add up.

@CallMeIo

Tone Town.
Sorry I doubted you.

@CallMeIo

If you were scum.
I would have seen the tone today.
I see a Town Tone.

And now Wazza is town! And why? Because tone

@CallMeIo

Here’s a perfect example and why Wazza Is now my Town Read.
Scum Wazza would have still had me as a scum read. Why?
Well no it doesn’t count for everyone but specifically on how Wazza’s Playstyle is.
He’s the kind of player to be a little more laid back and not care that much about what people thinkish.
So it’s like scum him wouldn’t have re-evaluated me or if they did would have still had me as scum.
Only Town Wazza here actually opens there eyes after the ash flip and Null town leans me.
Remember. Someone’s Playstyle isn’t alignment indicative and never think it is.
That’s how you lose games.

And now its a metaread. And a quite ironic one at that. “Scum him wouldn’t have re-evaluated me or if they did would have still had me as scum”
Look a little familiar?

---

I’m pretty sure Io was the fly in sulit’s room yesterday as all they are doing is hopping around and being a pest.

This is either a wolf or the worst villager I have had the (un)fortune of playing with.
As much as I want them to die today, as, let’s be honest, it might just be +EV to lynch this player regardless of alignment, I will be patient and wait it out.

Do not allow this player to control the thread. Thank you.

[Flameo]

Sigh… this feels out of a left field. Saying multiple times the phrase that I’d be “misunderstanding” things makes me look socially inept and by extension would devalue my reads. I needed them to clarify that point, not only for my ego or whatever, but so others would not read it that way as well.

In addition I don’t like being parsed in a flowchart, the examples had major flaws and CatLover had already been trending downward in my reads.

Can you please elaborate on this read?

[Flameo]

Io’s declaration of skill is funny to me considering they are voting me based on a preflip and solely that it seems. They have also not given any reasons why they think Elephas is scum besides a yellow check claim. They are just using appeal to authority fallacy by citing their “incredible skill”

They are also ignoring my questions which is… fun.

[Elephas]

I apologize for my rude comments in my last post.
Frustration is getting to me.

Going to tone it down a notch, apologies.

Flameo you seem to be the only other player in the thread at this moment. Is there anything you would like to talk about?

[Flameo]

Not really, just checking in before work, which kind of starts now. I have more Vulgard points that I’ll get to once I’m back. Will be here before end of day.

It’s somewhat disheartening that few players are willing to work with me and actively build towards consensus vote. Mafia are 3 vote strong here, so casting vanity votes is not good enough. Town has to work as a team. I know I’m stubborn on my own reads, but I’m really trying at least… to bridge differences as much as I know how

[Elephas]

I look forward to it.

I still have my doubts on Vulgard, but I think its more of paranoia than actual scumreading.

I will absolutely be re-reading quite a lot before I come back into the thread tomorrow (too tired as of now). I do not want wolves to have control at the end of this day, so we need to establish a consensus wagon and counterwagon.

[an_gorta_pratai]

@Wisp

@an_gorta_pratai
how do you not have a wolf read?

I haven’t read many people, but I want to look at Vul, Ele, and Flameo (and maybe Mole again)

[Flameo]

@an_gorta_pratai

I haven’t read many people, but I want to look at Vul, Ele, and Flameo (and maybe Mole again)

Can you please do that before the game is over? Your whole ISO is defending Mole and yourself thus far.

Are you suggesting with those names that these are players you get scum signals from? (including me I guess…)

[an_gorta_pratai]

I am looking at those names so that I can determine their alignment for myself because those are the names going around

[Moleland]

And people said I was mean

[Vulgard]

@SirDerpsAlot

Vul how well has this worked out for you before

I usually don’t live to YeetLo as V. And if I do, I re-evaluate everyone.
Sometimes I end up voting a villager anyway, but not always.

@Elephas

While I enjoy being in a “never yeet” group, I’m unsure why I am there from your perspective. If you already explained, please point me to it.

Content, volume, and multiple levels of thought which I think are beyond a wolf’s capability to fake. You’d have to be an insanely effective wolf, adept at fabricating advanced reads, for you to be scum.

I simply don’t think it can possibly be the case, by Occam’s Razor.

If there’s anyone I’m doubting in that group, it’s Wisp, mostly because his investment has lowered lately. That said, he wrote some very towny posts before.

@CatLover

Why are you going to believe everything we say? Regardless of our alignments, even if you town read us very strongly, I would much rather we had a dialogue about reads instead of you just believing what I say! Even if you are ride-or-die on someone being town, they can still be wrong , and I would rather have you talk to me about my reads, rather than believing them immediately.

That’s not it, actually, I’m just not going to assume you’re pushing agenda. Believing that you’re right =/= believing that your reads are not fabricated.

@Wisp

@an_gorta_pratai
how do you not have a wolf read?

I frankly don’t know what he’s doing even though I called him town earlier.
Might retract the read at this rate.

@CallMeIo

Mole is Probably Elephas partner so I don’t mind this yeet.

Can you stop drawing preflips? I know I did that earlier, but I walked back on it.

@CatLover

What about my case on Vulgard? Anybody want to talk about that with me? I spent a long time on it and I would like everyone’s thoughts on it!

I could offer mine, but offering thoughts about a case on my own slot seems silly.

@CallMeIo

If I had to guess right now.
I’d say CatLover, Elephas and Flameo is the Team.

This is openwolfing if Io is scum. Posts like these are why I don’t believe Io is a wolf.

@Centuries

This exists idk what Vulgard think of Flameo rn @Vulgard can you state how this line of thought evolved?

It didn’t, I dropped it. I’m not a very organized player.

@Leafia

Take me for example. Have I done anything that I absolutely wouldn’t have done as scum in a million years? Nope. Have I done anything I wouldn’t do as town in a million years? Also nope. I’d agree with Vulgard honestly on how hard I am to read. Possibly one of the toughest players to metaread on the site because of how similar my town and scum games are, which I definitely think will help in games where I’m scum. I will admit that I have said and/or done things I’d be unlikely to do as scum, but then again, I’ve probably said and/or done things this game that I’d be unlikely to do as town as well. All in all, I’m not sure I deserve to be in anyone’s towncore this early in the game, even if I’m pleased that Flameo has me in theirs.

This feels like a wolf Leafia post.

@Leafia

I’ll also admit that I have said things for the sole purpose of getting towncred, although while I can understand that looking like a scummy thing to do, I think even townies want people to read them as town so that their opinions and views are listened to, which is why it can be NAI as well.

This one too. Not because it’s self-meta, but because it’s incredibly LAMIST.

@Wisp

I only slept like 4 hours last night, and its 2 am

Stop doing that.

@Elephas

This is either a wolf or the worst villager I have had the (un)fortune of playing with.

whispers
I think it’s the 2nd.