[VFM] Town vs Bandits - Day 5 (4/13) - Bandits Win!

[Marluxion]

i mean you’re asking the guy who’s only read the first 100 posts
i have only seen the gimmick enough to be annoyed by it and i haven’t seen any of eli’s actual takes yet

[Prophylaxis]

hi

just rolled out of bed, gimme a sec to read up

[Arctic]

speak of the devil
i’m gonna walk my dog for a bit then i’ll be back to talk

[Prophylaxis]

sounds good

i’d post some entrance meme here but i’m sleepy as shit and not in a meme mood rn

[Prophylaxis]

@Arctic

yeah, uh
no
to be honest

What are your thoughts about the reasons I pulled out where Ghana might be a villager? (him trying to explain himself, saying that his chloe townread was fake, or him choosing specifically alice and I to focus on for Today)

What do you think of his tunnel on me and what that means for his alignment?

@Vulgard

The SPF/Chloe read was not a preflip. I just called them “not W/W,” which is a dissociative, not a preflip. I’m not sure how everyone could’ve read that post and concluded I was preflipping these two, when I clearly wasn’t. W/V and W/W would be preflips, but “not W/W” is the opposite, really.

Are you serious about this?

You literally had two posts before you wrote the “not w/w” where you implied heavily that you thought Chloe and spf were either both independent scumreads or aligned with each other. These were posts 79 and 110.

@Vulgard

This is where I would vote SPF if I didn’t already think Chloe’s a wolf. But SPF can be her partner ig.

@Vulgard

Maybe. Out of everyone who’s posted so far, though, I think Chloe’s posting was the worst, followed by SPF simply because SPF hasn’t really said anything yet.

Then, in post 115 you go:

@Vulgard

SPF/Chloe not W/W

I know SPF busses. That’s a known fact. However, I don’t think SPF would bus here, like this (I know this barely even counts as bussing as W/W, but bear with me).

What do I mean by “like this?” I mean that she’s clearing a villager in the process, when she doesn’t have to do this as a wolf. She could wolfread Chloe without calling someone V off Chloe’s potential red flip right away.

I don’t believe in this very strongly, but it is a thought.

First of all, your usage of the joycat in this post made me hard to believe you were being serious despite concluding the post with some insight. Secondly, I’m pretty sure that 2-3 people ITT were townreading Arctic/Leafia already by the time this post happened, so I don’t think it’s a stretch for wolf!spf to do this sort of thing. And third, I know you mentioned this in the post, but spf’s post is more of a Point of Concern wrt Chloe. I wouldn’t call that post an attack at all.

I find it hard to believe that you’d chastise the thread for thinking your position was w/w given that you said the opposite multiple times earlier, in ways that were more clear.

@Vulgard

In the early-game, I overplay my feelings a lot to get the game going. I very rarely go back to any takes I expressed in the early-game unless I feel like they’re viable long-term. In this specific game we’re playing right now, that take would be “Arctic and Leafia town.”

Nope, you’re not doing this.

Why would you need to overplay your feelings here? I’ve never found a situation where FOL games need to “get the game going”. This game is full of good players who are all (mostly?) excited to play with each other. If this was like, my home site (MTG Salvation) then I could understand it because we’re insanely lurky, but I really have a hard time (again) thinking that you believe this.

You guys probably have the exact /opposite/ problem - Ciconia had an insane Day 1 and without the postcount limit I bet this game would have ballooned to over 1k posts already. Getting the game going is a nonexistent problem on this site, and you know this.

[Prophylaxis]

@Vulgard

That said. About Chloe and other people who pointed out my bad reads in Ciconia. I know my reads are bad. Do you really think I’m incapable of realizing my read accuracy’s horrible? That’s why I’m not trying to strongarm the thread or anything. The earlygame wolfread on Chloe was overplayed to get the game going. That’s what I regularly do in early-games. I can link to other games where I did the exact same thing and was often wolfread for it.

Please link me to these other games.

@Vulgard

Before closely scrutinizing, I have cursory townreads on Chloe, SPF, Proph. Stronger townreads on Arctic and Leafia – pretty much maintaining the reasoning from when I originally made the read. Arctic and Leafia’s later posting also didn’t strike me as wolfy.

Get me reasoning on this if you can. No rush, just want to see your progression from when you slept last night to when you woke up (and I assume skimmed the thread)

[Prophylaxis]

@Arctic

i have no idea what the answer to this question is but thank you for introducing me to the term “townsplain”

credit to uhhhhh. montecore from MU I think, he hates when people do this

@Arctic

proph’s posting is incontrovertibly villagery and fits with what i’m used to, i also agree with a lot of his takes but i’m not really sure what to do at this stage because i know he’s perfectly capable of coming up with everything he has as a wolf. there isn’t really something at the level of nuance of like, spf’s take i commented on earlier for example that show he’s really going into deeper analysis. im gonna be super paranoid of this slot since i just finished a game where i worked with him pretty well, so he knows what he has to do if he wants to buddy up with me.

What takes of mine exactly do you agree on? You had kind of a null-read on Chloe last time I checked, you were scumreading Ghana, and you weren’t as sure on Vulgard as either Chloe and I were.

Would also agree to some extent that I could fake my wallposts pretty easily as wolf - it’s what I did to Chloe a lot throughout DitF. Think the best way to read me is to track my motivation and energy levels throughout the game and figure out if I actually want to be here as opposed to forcing myself to be here. (I know Marl was a wolf in that game, but he kinda hit the nail on the head in Ciconia)

[Vulgard]

Eh. I guess trying to meme and be more openly friendly than usual just reads as awkward and wolfy. Whatever.

@Vulgard

Chloe/SPF are pretty much a “depth of thought” read. Yes, I do respect their wolfgames. But no, I don’t think that should stop me from townreading them, when I believe their depth of thought and angles of consideration represent a TMI-less perspective.

My reasoning for these two townreads is literally in the same post you’re asking me about. Are you a wolf who doesn’t care enough to read?

@Vulgard

Proph is me wanting to assume he’s town until proven otherwise, because like he said, we’ve wanted to play a game together for a while.

Same with the Proph read.

Him asking a question that’s answered in the same post is suspicious. It’s like he doesn’t actually care about this information. It was there for him to find, the post wasn’t long at all, and he just didn’t.

[Vulgard]

@Prophylaxis

@Vulgard

Before closely scrutinizing, I have cursory townreads on Chloe, SPF, Proph. Stronger townreads on Arctic and Leafia – pretty much maintaining the reasoning from when I originally made the read. Arctic and Leafia’s later posting also didn’t strike me as wolfy.

Get me reasoning on this if you can. No rush, just want to see your progression from when you slept last night to when you woke up (and I assume skimmed the thread)

The reasoning for all three is in the same post. I’m not sure how you can read about my townreads and miss the reasoning (if you care about the reasoning), when it’s right there.

[Vulgard]

Yolo.

Alice/Leafia/SPF/Chloe/Arctic/GGhana/Emilia/WWA/Marl V.
Proph/willtaylor/Eli W.

Maybe slot Marl into the W zone if one is a miss.

[Vulgard]

I can’t wait to be accused of not believing what I’m saying again.

[Prophylaxis]

@Arctic

i had a similar thought but the fact this was like his fisrt actual substance post actually makes me think the opposite, to be honest. by his own admission in ciconia, faking dumb paranoia/tinfoils is incredibly easy and he does this all the time as a wolf. the fact this was his first real thing to say about the game doesn’t help me shrug off the feeling that it was deliberately crafted

What are your thoughts about the interaction I pulled up? Where spf asked Marl for reads and he just went like “no” twice (he did say that Alice was scummy for railing on him IIRC). Reason why I think it’s slightly villagery for Marl is because I just distinctly remember him trying to appease me when he was realtiming with me as scum in Ciconia.

[Vulgard]

/vote Prophylaxis

[Vulgard]

I have a convincing argument to make you all vote him.

prophylaxisus

[Wazza]

last time I’m reminding any of you:

@Wazza

• To vote a player, type /vote [name] @Wazza otherwise the vote will not count.

[Vulgard]

/vote prophylaxisus

@Wazza

[Prophylaxis]

Dude, “I believe their depth of thought and angles of consideration represent a TMI-less perspective” is barely a read.

I need to see your thought process - the progression - that made you go from “Chloe is wolfy because I think her reminding Leafia about the postcount limit is wolfy specifically for her” to “I have a cursory townread on her”. I need quotes. You’ve given like, no indication at all to me that you’ve at least tried to skim the thread and have read Chloe/spf’s posts.

[Wazza]

Votecount

Voted	Voters	Count
Prophylaxis	GGhana, Vulgard	2
Vulgard	Chloe, Prophylaxis	2
GGhana	Leafia	1
Marluxion	Arctic	1
Not Voting	Alice, willtaylor, Marluxion, staypositivefriend, WindwardAway, EliThePsycho, Emilia	7

Majority is disabled for today. Ping me for votes. Day ends at 2021-08-30T20:00:00Z

[Prophylaxis]

I feel like Vulg tried to TR me in order to see if I’d get off his back, but now that I’m finding more issues with his posts, he’s just putting up his quills like a porcupine.

@GGhana

No it isn’t, his wallposting is wolfy as shit and is exactly what I expected from him coming into today

Almost all of it is just full of nothingburgers about Vulgard and Chloe, as far as I can tell I didn’t actually grasp a single opinion of his in that post at all, it’s a good wall but that doesn’t mean it’s a villagery one.

This is just pretty much a blatant misrepresentation of what I’ve said in my wallposts.

I came to the conclusion that Vulg is a wolf because I don’t believe what he’s saying. And I said that Chloe was gun-to-head villager for today because I’d like to work with her today. How is any of that a “nothingburger”?

@GGhana

it’s a good wall but that doesn’t mean it’s a villagery one.

Fourth time this exact phrase or something close to it has been used wrt me

Swear wolves are trying to keep me in the PoE

@GGhana

Plus the whole “I’m just gonna stay in thread and wait for people to interact with me” thing from him feels like it’s more likely to come from a wolf this game state because I think a wolf is more likely to want to try to be slightly more frozen than they usually are considering the player list

When I’ve posted a shitton of content in a short period of time, and no one else is around ITT, of course I’m going to say something like this. I want people to actually read my posts and either engage with me about them (preferred) or come to an opinion about them. I was actually still absent-mindedly rereading the thread and asking questions, so again you’re misrepping me

@GGhana

Proph’s walls all feel like he’s trying to appeal to everyone rather than give any actual opinions of his own.

Again I have several townreads and a singular wolfread, if you bothered to read my post closely

@GGhana

Like this feels incredibly gross

Most of the other reads are gross but this one is even grosser

It feels like he’s trying to encourage Chloe while still staying in the sidelines, so she can take the blame/pocket her depending on what Vul flips

Now that I’ve actually backread I don’t think Alice was doing it but Proph definitely is

Why is this post “gross”?

I’m just confused because a part of me still thinks somewhat that Vulg wouldn’t play /this bad/ as a wolf. He was Communications in the invi and he was very easily able to amass townreads in that game. He was a wolf in Gold Rush and endgamed in 5v3 xylo a while back. I’m committed to extinguishing w!Vulgard - I’m not staying in the sidelines at all.

[GGhana]

@Prophylaxis

I came to the conclusion that Vulg is a wolf because I don’t believe what he’s saying. And I said that Chloe was gun-to-head villager for today because I’d like to work with her today. How is any of that a “nothingburger”?

What you’re saying now doesn’t somehow influence the wall you posted before

Insisting otherwise is just fallacious