What Classes Need A Rework (too weak)

He absolutely does.

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Are you being sarcastic?

You know what would be a better idea.

Take physician, remove the day ability and replace it with 4 shots of night immunity, and give it the power to kill 2 people.

Not at all

Also isnā€™t CW suppose to get a rework? :thinking:

Thatā€™s a weakness, not counterplay. Thereā€™s no way to counter execute.

That can happen to any class. And thatā€™s another weakness, not a counterplay.

Thatā€™s a bad argument. A lot of classes havenā€™t been changed yet, but that doesnā€™t mean that theyā€™re balanced.

Why on earth do you think butler needs a 2 use bullet proof which confirms him?

Because butler is weak compared to the other BD offensive drunk

Nerfing him is not a good idea

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Well boslof has no plans to change it

Oh butler needs a secondary ability to give him more power definately. He doesnā€™t need a bulletproof which confirms him tho lol.

Saying ā€œx class would be weak without x abilityā€ is not a defense because obviously any bad abilities wouldnā€™t just be removed theyā€™d be replaced.

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Concentrated wine is far less confirmable than Serve Wine anyway.

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The ability makes him better for Unseen and also lets him play more aggressively than drunk. It impacts his optimal play style in a good way.

You canā€™t just compare him to drunk to justify balance, you have to look at the game as a whole. I see a lot of people comparing drunk and butter and while itā€™s true that drunk is stronger it doesnā€™t justify giving a roleblocker basically impenetrable bullet proof vests. It reduces the importance of protectives and make protection chains too viable. It justifies lazy play from BD as the need to work together is diminished when blockers can self protect. There needs to be some classes that are killable easily - not every class can be a one man army.

I donā€™t hate it, but butler definately doesnā€™t need it.

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Suggestions to replace it?

Just remove all BD,Evil and Neutral classes and turn them into Civilians and Goons, this is balanced.

Make Days last 2 days too

Happy hour and concentrated wine could be swapped.

Swap happy hour and party.

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Butler needā€™s a defensive ability but drunk does not.

Every class doesnā€™t need a defensive ability.