Emotional stress in Fol/FM

[Firekitten]

We then argue with them

[Solic]

Give a game where that happened then please if you want to use yourself as an example.

[Emilia]

I mean I am pretty bad town player but I still try

[sulit]

[ERROR]

Brain cannot seem to remember 1/2 of the words to form a sentence! Please try again later!

[sulit]

Why do you think they don’t try though

[Emilia]

e r r o r

[Solic]

I don’t think you are a bad town player, but you lack conviction and don’t try to champion your reads enough over other players.

I also don’t recall any recent games where you were chastised for not trying.

[Vulgard]

@Solic

inside of games using your reputation or level of skill is just a trait you can use to further your game and fulfill your win condition.

You’re right, but that’s the type of player I never want to play with. There are countless strategies. Don’t use the one that makes you sound like a condescending asshole.

[Vulgard]

I guess we just have different perspectives on how to play mafia. I play primarily to have fun (as my profile description implies) so people being assholes always impacts this negatively and I don’t want to play with them.

But playing for fun doesn’t mean I don’t want to improve. I believe the two are not mutually exclusive. Some players just make it seem that way.

[Geyde]

@Vulgard

The thing is, there seems to be a pressure to play well but nobody will tell you how to play well, just link you guides perhaps and say ‘that’s it.’

Guides aren’t everything.

The problem is…

It’s really hard to help people improve in FM without forcing your will upon them
The best most people can do is link bland generalizations about how to play and critique logic in the moment

[Geyde]

@Solic

@anon97870008

you always try to defend toxicity

That was an example of being toxic, not defending toxicity.

Also Ici criticized you for not force replacing instead of modkilling. That’s different (and also something that a newbie host shouldn’t be criticised for so harshly in my opinion)

It’s a hosting thing
It’s more judging to what extent is a modkillable offense

[Geyde]

This is the most true statement on this entire topic

Experienced = at least like 5 completed games at the barest minimums
Even then it’s just semi experienced

[Vulgard]

I was talking about situations where people tell you ‘you’re bad’ ‘this is bad’ but they won’t tell you how to make it good.

Being forceful/not forceful is not what I was talking about.

[Vulgard]

And I’ve noticed that it happens a lot.

[Geyde]

I’m talking about those exact same situations
In the middle of a game…it’s hard

[Solic]

@Vulgard

I guess we just have different perspectives on how to play mafia. I play primarily to have fun (as my profile description implies) so people being assholes always impacts this negatively and I don’t want to play with them.

But playing for fun doesn’t mean I don’t want to improve. I believe the two are not mutually exclusive. Some players just make it seem that way.

I also play primarily to have fun. I think being real about there sometimes being a gap in skill level and that affecting the game doesn’t automatically make the person doing that a condescending asshole. If I’m going to infer that for example Alice will be likely visited a lot, because she’s a skilled player and use that as an argument in thread, I don’t really feel like an asshole for doing that. Some players have been doing this for ages and some are better at it than others. That’s just reality. I never ignore players that give their reads with good arguments behind them. If however one player, whom I don’t consider skilled, is just saying x is scum because ‘gut’ and upon further probing don’t give anything else, then I’m just going to completely ignore what they say yes.

[Vulgard]

I feel like we’ve misunderstood each other. Pointing out that someone is better isn’t assholish to me. Pointing out that you are better is also fine (to a certain extent). Acting like that makes everyone else bad and acting like the most important infallible person in the thread (in extreme cases) is assholish.

[anon97870008]

@Solic

I don’t feel the responsibility for helping players get better. If people ask nicely, I will likely gladly offer my thoughts on particular situations or their playstyle, but I don’t come here to just actively mentor everyone, where I would even have to make the initiative.

Why do “skilled” players need to be responsible for the “unskilled” players not improving? You can correct me, but in my mind I only am mad at players that don’t put in effort.

Yes. As good player you have the responsibility for the others.
If you don’t want to have the responsibility, that’s fine, but then don’t belittle anyone for being less good than you. It’s your own fault, not theirs.

@Vulgard

I play primarily to have fun (as my profile description implies) so people being assholes always impacts this negatively and I don’t want to play with them.

[anon97870008]

@sulit

Screw MU articles tbqh

Lul. Well. They often have some truth, but I would never use them as guidelines for my own play.
We should encourage newbies to develop their own playstyles more.
Please “accept” our newbies and their ideas. They might be wrong. But they have deserved to be accepted. Often enough you learn a lot from newbies. Not just from old players.

[Solic]

@anon97870008

If you don’t want to have the responsibility, that’s fine, but then don’t belittle anyone for being less good than you . It’s your own fault, not theirs.

I don’t belittle others for being worse, but I will berate them if they don’t even try to be better.