Fake-Claiming on Trial

Class/Lore/Fanfic
#61

I would be upset if I was knight and got 2 scum killed due to fake claiming on the stand and then getting banned

2 Likes
#62

Well if the assassin is able to pull this off in one of these critical moments then it’s absolutely good play. I’d even go so far as to say it’s an excellent move on the assassins part, since at the very least in my examples there exists an EK which can follow up should the BD in question be an important power role such as Prince.

Which is why if the Prince recognizes this situation he ought not claim Prince

2 Likes
#63

TLDR:

Please stop saying that Fake claiming on trial as BD = Gamethrowing.

Instead say that it’s a possible indicator of gamethrowing or something along those lines. Otherwise you end up with confused people making threads like this one and being needlessly reported by people who are just following the rules to the letter, or people who didn’t read this thread ending up in a bizarre situation and losing out of fear of gamethrowing.

3 Likes
#64

also is there a rule against lying on the stand

I don’t think so.

Is there a rule against game throwing. Yes. But you can’t change the definition of game throwing

#65

@NuclearBurrito talked more about the above post before

#66

There is apparently, hence the existence of this thread.

#67

It’s not mentioned in the actual rules. People are saying it’s game throwing when it isn’t. You can’t change the definition of game throwing

#68

There isn’t. I just checked the ingame rules.

1 Like
#69

tl;dr It’s reportable :wink: Have a nice day.

#70

if it was reportable why is it not in the rules

1 Like
#71

fake claiming isn’t proof enough that it’s intent on throwing the game. Therefore it’s not game throwing.

1 Like
#72

Thank you for explaining me the rules. I’m sure that will help a lot!

#73

I can feel the sarcasm

1 Like
#74

No problem

3 Likes
#75

That’s a silly argument, justifying lying as blue dragon off-trial just because people might not notice their claim? Blue Dragon doesn’t fake-claim in the hopes that nobody notices, they fake-claim hoping people DO notice. Only evils sometimes hope people forgot their earlier fake claim.

And forgetting claims is a negligible aspect of gameplay if people use logs and private notes correctly so shouldn’t be taken into account anyway.

2 Likes
#76

Appeal to authority is a fallacy.

If you can’t easily explain why it is against the rules in every situation, you might want to question whether it shouldn’t be redefined or be given exceptions. I’m not doing any of the work enforcing or upholding that whatsoever however, so I just hope you see some merit in our argumentation.

4 Likes
#77

In the vast majority of cases in ToL, it is suboptimal for BD to fakeclaim on the stand. If the rule were typically expressed as ‘do not fakeclaim on the stand or in jail unless you believe it to be furthering your win condition,’ then suddenly we’d have a lot less leeway to handle the cases when it’s actually just throwing (which is most of them) – maybe the Butler who fakeclaimed Alch on the stand after being found K/O was just making a play to avoid being killed as a high-priority target (etc.) In cases where there truly is a case to be made for them doing it, we’ll have access to the game logs and be able to see that. I’m not going to give specific examples of what punishments I’d recommend in different cases, because that sounds like a recipe for people going on a loophole hunt, but reports are in fact handled by real people.

#78

so would I be suspended for fake-claiming as heathen

#79

Honestly, i don’t see how fake-claiming as BD is gamethrowing. Except in specific circumstances, of course.

1 Like
#80

It is reportable - I don’t say more, I don’t say less. Reportable =/= punishable.