They do, they kill evils. Believe it or not they help evils.
They are a balancing act to make sure no side gets too big, they kill BD early game and evils late. It’s literally the perfect class.
Killing evils can help them more than not killing them though. Especially in unseen games where you can only have 3, and like I said before require a fast game to win.
Convert + kill is two bd dead per night. So you’re still wrong.
A dead evil is still a dead evil. They also can kill your faster then they can convert
If they guess perfectly and don’t hit mastermind, then sure. That still doesn’t change the fact unseen would have <20% winrate without a neutral killer to make the games go faster.
The percentages are wrong though. Yes they would have a lower win rate but the percentages are wrong.
Try 5% to 10%
Why should a one-man faction win anywhere close to 3/20 games, much less one out of every 5?
The math was gotten by averaging the probability of randomly picking a faction with the probability of picking any given faction member.
Think of it this way:
1: A perfectly balanced game of Forum Mafia gives town a winrate of 50% and mafia a winrate of 50%
2: For the same reason adding an additional faction should make all 3 factions have a 33% winrate
3: Losing is less satisfying than winning. Meaning that winrate should be weighed in terms of players
4: The best way to accommodate multiple ideals in this context is to average their results
5: The average of 7 and 33 (the ideal number for each system) is 20. Therefore a balenced SK that takes into account as meny variables as possible should have a winrate of 20%
1 Like
If you repeat the reasoning for BD and Unseen/Cult then BD should be 45% and Unseen/Cult should be 35%
Yeah yeah I know how that is calculated
But I still think a single player should not be winning that often
10% is probably fine, would personally like lower but anywhere around there is ok imo
The mere existence of nightkills in mountainous mafia shows that a single member of a minority faction is supposed to be stronger than a single member of a majority faction. This reasoning extends to an SK
No. But at same time Open Setup Rolemadness is undeniably Town-Sided even if Mafia would have some really powerful members.
If NK isn’t in hand of competent player he’s more like a obstacle rather than threat.
You fail to account for the fact that, on some level, the NK is not its own faction. It is a player who exists to speed up the game first, and winning should be a difficult task. Achievable yes, but not averaging its proportion with it as its own faction - it just isn’t its own faction, and shouldn’t be as likely to win.
Well that’s a statement I fundamentally disagree with.
3 mafia members are a faction
If you remove 1 it is still a faction
If you remove another it is STILL a faction
Since 1 Mafia member is identical to an SK in this context that means that an SK is a faction member of a one man faction.
It fits with how winconditions are set up, it fits with most balence philosophies and it fits with how SK’s work in mafiascum FM
1 Like
But you’d only ever have one Mafia in a game with very few Town
In a setup of a majority vs a minority, the NKs are third party roles and not truly their own faction. Treating them as such for balancing purposes leads to them winning too much, which is both frustrating to play against and takes away from the importance of scumreading against a coordinated faction - the point of the game.
That isn’t important. Is there some number of town that would make a 3 man mafia team no longer a faction? If yes then we will talk
1 Like